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Old 05-12-2005, 03:31 PM   #61
ara325
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Remember this, the more quantity a car mfg pumps out of the factory, the higher the probability of errors...this fact can't be ignored or stopped. The chart on the previous posts measures defects per 1000 cars built. REALLY it should be rated as a % of defects per the total production fleet (this will level the playing field across ALL manufacturers). So, naturally, there's going to be more complaints about Bimmers than say 10 years ago...why not, everyone and their mother has a BMW in Toronto...it kinda pisses me off actually because the long-time enthusiasts who once "stood out in a crowd" now are just another "part of the crowd"...faaaack the crowd! and the superficial "i'm cool b/c i drive a Bimmer that's nicer than my neighbours".

True Bimmer lovers know that they don't need to justify why they're driving their cars.

And for all who complain about their BMW's...see ya! one less Bimmer on the raod.
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Old 05-12-2005, 06:59 PM   #62
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Here's another JD report, this one from 2004.
Note:
1. Position of Toyota
2. Position of Porche


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Old 05-12-2005, 07:23 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncmedia
* Bimmers are in a class on their own, and the mods/chips/tuner work available to each owner gives them way more play than most cars, and the ability to customize without going nutty on costs,
For my car: Chip about $700 USD
Intake: Cheapest ever: $280 USD (before that $1000 USD)
Coilovers: over $1000 USD easy
Muffler: Around $1000 USD
Rims: around $3,000 - $4,000 USD
S/C: $10,000 - $25,000 USD



Quote:
Originally Posted by ncmedia
how many bimmers you know that look exactly alike
How about every 3 series model of a given year. People still aren't exactly sure what my car is.
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Old 05-12-2005, 07:30 PM   #64
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good god u guys are scaring me...some excellent points were raised in this thread. Yes BMW is NOT "THE" best automaker out there....but WHO is?...nobody thats who...every manuf. has their pros and cons(as stated earlier in the thread). It's just the fact that we're BMW enthusiasts that we appreciate these Munich Monsters...just the same way honda enthusiasts love their JDM beauties...and categorizing other honda boards as all 'ricers' isn't really fair, i know QUITE a good # of ppl who own cleanly done up hondas, in fact i wouldn't be surprised down the line if i own another honda/toyota along with my bimmer...fact is their awesome commuter cars as their great on gas/cheap to repair.

But i love bmws for what they are...BMWs, they don't need to be the best...i love how they look, i love how they sound, & i love how they perform.

But i understand Betray's frustration, 62k and tranny failure is horrible...hopefully u have no more hardshps with the car in the near future....
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Old 05-12-2005, 08:12 PM   #65
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haha...what a thread i seriously laughed at most of these replies....sad how some people bullshit so much...

at least some people get the damn facts, thank you sickfinga.
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Old 05-12-2005, 09:11 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ara325
Remember this, the more quantity a car mfg pumps out of the factory, the higher the probability of errors...this fact can't be ignored or stopped.
Not true .. go tell that to Koenigsegg or Bugatti owners .. they will laugh at you.
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Old 05-12-2005, 10:30 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raging Lamb
How about every 3 series model of a given year. People still aren't exactly sure what my car is.
Agreed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raging Lamb
Here's another JD report, this one from 2004.
Note:
1. Position of Toyota
2. Position of Porche


lolowowolol
kia > porsche

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpWhitE46
haha...what a thread i seriously laughed at most of these replies....sad how some people bullshit so much...

at least some people get the damn facts, thank you sickfinga.
I love how you can completely disregard fact and go with whatever conclusion your mind has created for you.
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Old 05-12-2005, 10:52 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miguel
I agree 100%.

BMW... not as reliable as Toyota, lexus, etc.
BMW... not as luxurious as mercedes...
BMW... not as fast as domestic cars in a straight line
BMW... not as good in the twisties as a subaru
BMW... not as cheap to buy as *.ahellofalotofcars

Bimmers are OK at everything and top of the class at nothing.

That is honestly the most ignorant post I've seen you write.

BMW... not as reliable as Toyota, lexus, etc.

Um yeah, but since Toyota was what, near or was #1, neither was any other car. Same could be said for any other car company.

BMW... not as luxurious as mercedes...

Like vlad said, depends on which model. And its not as expensive as mercedes either. Mercedes isn't as sporty as BMW. But you buy for what you want. If you want luxury over handing, u buy benz, or vice versa.

BMW... not as fast as domestic cars in a straight line

So all domestic cars are faster than BMW. OK!

BMW... not as good in the twisties as a subaru

Again, Vlad got you on this one.

BMW... not as cheap to buy as *.ahellofalotofcars

But not as expensive as *.ahellofalotofcars


Sure bmw isn't the best at everything, but who is? No body, same goes for every other THING on the face of this planet.

And maybe if you didn't have a lemon, you would see differently. You have a completely biased opinion. I don't think I've ever seen you take a view from both sides.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:01 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ara325
Remember this, the more quantity a car mfg pumps out of the factory, the higher the probability of errors...this fact can't be ignored or stopped.
I strongly disagree with this. The more cars an automakers produces the more quality errors they correct. This is why the first year of a new design always has the most problems, they didn't get a chance to work out any bugs yet. Conversely, the last year of a product cycle is always the most reliable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ara325
The chart on the previous posts measures defects per 1000 cars built. REALLY it should be rated as a % of defects per the total production fleet (this will level the playing field across ALL manufacturers). So, naturally, there's going to be more complaints about Bimmers than say 10 years ago...why not, everyone and their mother has a BMW in Toronto
That doesn't make any sense. Whether you use the problems per 1000 vehicles or your idea of % of total production, the number of BMW's sold shouldn't affect the number of complains within those statistical categories at all. It's still proportional. Also the % idea wouldn't make the ratings change significantly, 1000 cars is a high number that would effectively eliminate any possible low-production errors in ratings. The quality of 1000 random cars should definitely be enough to judge the entire production fleet.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:13 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryousuke
I agree Porsche is prob the best bang for the dolar sports car you could buy and reliability is there better then any other car in the price range. They used the block for GT3 and GT2 and TT from GT1 thats why most porsches run without a hitch of a problem with 600+ HP and are daily drivers.
Second this.
Maybe not in north america but when I was in Germany their about as common as an Acura is to us. When old they keep their reliability and resale not to mention their actualy worth fixing when broken + they don't rust so mony spent not wasted. And the Europeans know it.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:16 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
BMW... not as reliable as Toyota, lexus, etc.

Um yeah, but since Toyota was what, near or was #1, neither was any other car. Same could be said for any other car company.
actually, according to that lil chart... Honda and Hyundai WERE close to Toyota.... while BMW was close to GM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
BMW... not as luxurious as mercedes...

Like vlad said, depends on which model. And its not as expensive as mercedes either. Mercedes isn't as sporty as BMW. But you buy for what you want. If you want luxury over handing, u buy benz, or vice versa.
not as sporty as bmw?!? remind me again, what bimmer is going to overtake an SLR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
BMW... not as fast as domestic cars in a straight line

So all domestic cars are faster than BMW. OK!
....hmmm.... SRT-4 > then what? 90% of bimmers?
not to mention....

vette
viper
anything with SRT in the name
ford lightning?
you know as well as I do that there are a hell of a lot of faster domestics for half the price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
BMW... not as good in the twisties as a subaru

Again, Vlad got you on this one.
oh really? try a wet track or a canadian snow storm...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
BMW... not as cheap to buy as *.ahellofalotofcars

But not as expensive as *.ahellofalotofcars
oh really?!? base 320i = MSRP $34,950
have you SEEN the specs on what that $35K gets you in a 320i?
do you REALLY want to contest my fact or just concede defeat now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamite
Sure bmw isn't the best at everything, but who is? No body, same goes for every other THING on the face of this planet.

And maybe if you didn't have a lemon, you would see differently. You have a completely biased opinion. I don't think I've ever seen you take a view from both sides.
correction, my E34 was a lemon. My 325i has been one of the most reliable cars I've ever owned.

I do look at both sides and I DID rebuy a bmw. Im not saying they are bad cars, but Im not saying they are god's gift either.

In all fairness, most of the people praising em blindly in this thread don't even OWN a bmw.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:24 PM   #72
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Case closed.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:37 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miguel
actually, according to that lil chart... Honda and Hyundai WERE close to Toyota.... while BMW was close to GM.
.
JD POwers reports are shit, PERIOD. It doesnt really show if a car higher quality than another. Here is how it works, new owners after puttin 5000miles on a car report what they dont like about the car. Can be anything, from a smell of the car to the blown engine.

Quote:

not as sporty as bmw?!? remind me again, what bimmer is going to overtake an SLR.
Here is a reminder, M3 CLS is faster around Nurburgring than SLR, and a lot faster too


Quote:
....hmmm.... SRT-4 > then what? 90% of bimmers?
not to mention....

vette
viper
anything with SRT in the name
ford lightning?
you know as well as I do that there are a hell of a lot of faster domestics for half the price.
Can faster american cars offer as much as BMW cars can?
Finish quality, resale value, handling, look, options etc all in one package?


Quote:
oh really? try a wet track or a canadian snow storm...
Who races during snow storms?
ok, wet track maybe? but my point is. SRT4 is faster than WRX around dry track. Let me repeat that again, a front wheel drive AMERICAN car handles better.

Quote:
oh really?!? base 320i = MSRP $34,950
have you SEEN the specs on what that $35K gets you in a 320i?
do you REALLY want to contest my fact or just concede defeat now?
True, but no one said BMW offered best prices.

Quote:
I do look at both sides and I DID rebuy a bmw. Im not saying they are bad cars, but Im not saying they are god's gift either.

In all fairness, most of the people praising em blindly in this thread don't even OWN a bmw.
I dont believe anyone says BMW is THE BEST CAR EVER.
no car manufacturer is the best.

Last edited by SickFinga; 05-12-2005 at 11:43 PM.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:40 PM   #74
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wow, I didn't even have to reply, thanks vlad.
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Old 05-12-2005, 11:45 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SickFinga
JD POwers reports are shit, PERIOD. It doesnt really show if a car higher quality. Here is how it works, new owners after puttin 5000miles on a car report what they dont like about the car. Can be anything, from a smell of the car to the blown engine.
C'mon... give them a LITTLE bit more credit than that.
If you don't go by JDP who WILL you listen to before you admit it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickFinga
Can faster american cars offer as much as BMW cars can?
Finish quality, resale value, handling, look, options etc all in one package?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SickFinga
Who races during snow storms?
ok, wet track maybe? but my point is. SRT4 is faster than WRX around dry track. Let me repeat that again, a front wheel drive AMERICAN car handles better.
and exactly how MUCH faster was the bimmer than the WRX?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickFinga
True, but no one said BMW offered best prices.

I dont believe anyone says BMW is THE BEST CAR EVER.
no car manufacturer is the best.
one point we DO agree on.
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