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Old 09-09-2013, 12:26 PM   #16
dtthiaga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gleb View Post
No.

You're way over payload rating, which is more important than tow rating.
Your car weight estimate is in the ball park.
Actually, the Dakota will probably work. Eurostyle is bang on. I do a lot of towing as well with frame on body SUV's without any issues. Just be smart about it.

- Car Dolly is easier on the tow truck than a car trailer
(The draw back with the RWD car is, you probably should remove the driveshaft)
- Always put an external oil cooler. Especially on a Dodge!!!!!!!!
- Check the hitch and ball for the class/max load. The lowest value you find it what you should do.
- Follow two limits of the vehicle.

-Go to the uhaul website, and select vehicle towing. There is an option to see "Will this work". This is a very good start to your research.


--- examples...

98 Dakota (Regular Cab 4x4) - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

98 Dakota (Regular Cab 4x4) - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer (2200lbs trailer) !!! Not recommended



2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)


2008 Toyota 4Runner 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

2008 Toyota 4Runner 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:34 PM   #17
BigD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanehutton View Post
I put some thought into this before I bought mine and while I paid a lot more for my used aluminum trailer than a steel one, I think it was a decent call. The way I see it, the aluminum one is holding it's value and will not turn in to a rusted pile of junk over the years. When I am finished with mine, it will sell for near what I paid. If I only lose 1k on it then I think the benefits outweigh the investment. It is definitely more money up front though.
Same here with my aluminum enclosed. An open aluminum one didn't make sense as they cost similar to enclosed steel and the benefits of an enclosed trailer are oh so nice - especially if your track car isn't exactly an all weather thing. Coming back from WGI, a monsoon opened up and mine was happily boxed up while a bunch of racecars with open windows etc were getting soaked. It also doubles up as an extra garage, anyway, it's obviously worth it.

So I started looking at getting a steel enclosed but that would mean getting something with a 10k+ tow rating, and I've had my 4Runner since new. I know it's in good shape and it's paid for. I found these aluminum enclosed trailers and while expensive up front, it's a long term investment and it lets me keep the 4Runner.

Also an FYI, to anyone using a pickup to tow, you have other problems to worry about. At minimum, the truck and trailer must have the annual yellow inspection stickers. If you're using a 3/4 ton pickup with an enclosed trailer, you're really in for it, where your licensing will be epic expensive and you will need a trip log book and shit. Most people don't even know this until they get pulled over for it. And all of these concerns are void with an SUV (simply due to not being built with a cargo bed from the factory).
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:46 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigD View Post
Also an FYI, to anyone using a pickup to tow, you have other problems to worry about. At minimum, the truck and trailer must have the annual yellow inspection stickers. If you're using a 3/4 ton pickup with an enclosed trailer, you're really in for it, where your licensing will be epic expensive and you will need a trip log book and shit. Most people don't even know this until they get pulled over for it. And all of these concerns are void with an SUV (simply due to not being built with a cargo bed from the factory).
I think that only applies if you're total weight is over 4500kg/9900lbs. But yeah with a decent truck, trailer and car you're probably over that weight already,
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:55 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by thinair View Post
I think that only applies if you're total weight is over 4500kg/9900lbs. But yeah with a decent truck, trailer and car you're probably over that weight already,
No, anything with a cargo bed is a "commercial vehicle" (hence the black plates) and if you tow with it, it will need inspection stickers for both the truck and trailer. If you are over 4500kg it gets worse. You need a CVOR, and possibly log book, pre-trip inspection, huge licensing fees etc.
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Old 09-09-2013, 12:59 PM   #20
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How about this:
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/tru...trailers.shtml

If the trailer+load weight is under 2800kg then you don't need anything special. No?
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:09 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thinair View Post
How about this:
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/tru...trailers.shtml

If the trailer+load weight is under 2800kg then you don't need anything special. No?
I skimmed the link and as far as I can tell it's just talking about the 2800kg barrier. That barrier is when you get fisted. Here's a detailed explanation from a cop racer buddy of mine who's in charge of enforcing this stuff for Halton:

Quote:
1. Any vehicle that has a permanent cargo body is a commercial motor vehicle (therefore Suburbans, Ford Excursions, 4Runner etc are NOT commercial motor vehicles and the following does not apply). The weight which the commercial vehicle is registered for (number on your permit) is key in all "over weight" situations. If a commercial vehicle has a weight of 4500kg, or has a manufacture rating more than 4500kg, or is registered (on the ownership/permit) the vehicle must then also have a CVOR, annual yellow stickers, and appropriate weight on the permit. So, the lesson to take from this is, if your commercial motor vehicle is over 4500kg then you need a bunch of stuff--stay under 4500kg.

Most trucks are registered for 3000kg which is appropriate, but that weight is tied into trailers, as you will read below. What you may not realize is the more you register your truck for, the more you pay. For example, a tractor/truck registered for the maximuim in Ont (63500kg) pays approx $2800 for a new sticker. That is because that tractor, with trailer, weighs a lot and puts a lot of abuse on our roads, therefore they pay more. The tractor/truck itself only weighs 6000kg, but it is registered for far more because once a trailer weighs more than 2800 kg, then the weight of the trailer gets added to the truck for purpose of the permit. The lesson here is DONT LET YOUR TRAILER WEIGH MORE THAN 2800 KG, OTHERWISE THE WEIGHT OF IT WILL GET ADDED TO THE TRUCK FOR THE PURPOSE OF YOUR PERMIT REGISTERED WEIGHT. So, for example your pick up truck is registered for 3000kg and you are pulling a trailer weighing 2900kg. In this case your truck should be registered for approx 6000kg, costing you far more for your sticker. It also then requries a CVOR licence, pretrip inspection and potentially a log book. If you do not have these, here are some of the offences:
a) Overweight by (weight of truck/trailer combo - 3000kg).
b) no CVOR
c) no yellow stickers
d) no pre trip
e) no log book

2. Trailers: The Ministry understands people will use pickup trucks to haul stuff around, so you can haul up to 2800kg on your trailer without the weight being counted as a part of the truck. So, lets take another example. I have a average F150, at 2800 kg. My 19 foot open trailer and Corvette weigh 2200 kg combined. Because my trailer is LESS than 2800 kg the weight of it does not get added to my truck, so my Registered weight of 3000 kg on my ownership is fine and I am not overweight. However, because the combined total weight is OVER 4500kg, and because my pick up is a Commercial Motor vehicle, I now need a yellow annual inspection sticker on my truck and trailer. If I was using a Suburban/Tahoe etc I would not need this. The lesson from this is, it gets a lot more expensive/complex as soon as your trailer gets over 2800kg, regardless of size/length. To follow this same example with a heavier trailer, lets say I have that same truck now pulling a 3100 kg trailer. The 3100 kg gets added to my 2800 kg truck so my permit had better be for 5900 kg or else I can be charged with being over weight. In addition, because I now should registered my truck for more than 4500 kg I need a CVOR, pre trip inspection, Yellow stickers, and a log book. Ouch.

And...an exception. If the "trailer" has living quarters but still over the 2800kg, it is exempt from this and is deemed an RV. So if you have kitchen/bed in the front and your car in the back, you just need a yellow sticker and your are good to go--no need to increase the weight on your truck permit.

3. Also, if the trailer is over 4600kg you need a "Z" endorsement on your licence or you can't pull it.

4. If you register your truck for more than 11000 kg, you will need a class "D" licence....regardless if it empty or full.

5. The only time an officer will be concerned about the manufacturers weight rating will be for the permit (if its over 4500 kg) and the front axle rating. You can load your pick up truck nearly as much as you want and the only concern will be if you have overloaded the steering axle. The amount of weight it can take is listed on the door sticker and, of note, it is an offence to alter or remove the sticker.

6. So, my truck is an F150 Ford says it can only be 5350 kg maximum with the trailer. If I go to the MTO and re-register it for 10000kg, and I am dumb enough to put the weight load to 9000 kg and be stopped by an officer the only potential offence is "drive unsafe vehicle".
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:13 PM   #22
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Wow,

So much info,... I'm overwhelmed now

The thing that shocked me the most as 2 door vs 4 door on a trailer... is a 4 door that much more weight? Maybe its cause of the extra window motors, wiring harnesses and such that put it over the threshold, but I mean, I plan on hollowing these doors out, motors removed etc... I'm even debating on door locks, but I may keep them in since I will be storing the car off site, but at a family farm... Maybe enclosed might be better way to go in that case...

but I'll definitely need to be thinking bigger in that case... Perhaps an E350 makes sense, and old fleet vehicle that a company used and was up for lifecycle... But then I'm looking at commercial licensing, am I right?

Yeah, so much to think about... Also, why can't you use a dolly but put the rear wheels up on the dolly and lock the steering wheel... then you wouldn't have to worry about the driveshaft... right?

anyhow 4500lbs + tongue,... I'm definitely pushing the legal/safe limit of that Dakota... too bad cause it was so cheap... didn't look the greatest, had a bit of body damage here and there, so maybe not a suitable work vehicle...

Thanks everyone,

I need to pay off my furnace first before diving into another vehicle loan anyhow, just thought maybe I should pick up that Dakota if it could have worked...
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:51 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigD View Post
Also, if the trailer is over 4600kg you need a "Z" endorsement on your licence or you can't pull it
This I'm confused about, the Z endorsement is for air brakes.
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Old 09-09-2013, 01:58 PM   #24
BigD
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Originally Posted by thinair View Post
This I'm confused about, the Z endorsement is for air brakes.
He probably meant A. Or maybe trailers over 4600kg are required to have airbrakes... either way, no one's towing over 4600 here
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:12 PM   #25
thinair
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigD View Post
He probably meant A. Or maybe trailers over 4600kg are required to have airbrakes... either way, no one's towing over 4600 here
That makes more sense, my buddy regularly tows with his pickup to his 20,000lbs/9000kg limit (trailer only) with just electric brakes.
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Old 09-09-2013, 02:14 PM   #26
Nerk
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this is what I need then...

all in one truck+trailer

http://wwwa.autotrader.ca/a/Ford/F-8...howcpo=ShowCPO
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Old 09-09-2013, 09:35 PM   #27
richie_s999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shanehutton View Post
I put some thought into this before I bought mine and while I paid a lot more for my used aluminum trailer than a steel one, I think it was a decent call. The way I see it, the aluminum one is holding it's value and will not turn in to a rusted pile of junk over the years. When I am finished with mine, it will sell for near what I paid. If I only lose 1k on it then I think the benefits outweigh the investment. It is definitely more money up front though.
The same one was more then double to go aluminum, you just need to knock the surface rust off with a wire wheel and repaint annually in a couple spots, I'm actually going to rocker gaurd the trailer this fall too.

Also I have a steel deck with open Center, and for the middle I am going to use composite instead of wood so it doesn't hold moisture, bever understood wood decks on steel trailers

All in taxes and plated my 16ft beaver tail was just under $3000, I spent almost $2000 in Uhaul rentals last year, so even if I got 3 years outa the trailer I'm way ahead.
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Old 09-09-2013, 09:39 PM   #28
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Uhaul flat beds are 2300lbs, very heavy. Mine is 1600lbs. So there recommended what it can tow is high

Quote:
Originally Posted by dtthiaga View Post
Actually, the Dakota will probably work. Eurostyle is bang on. I do a lot of towing as well with frame on body SUV's without any issues. Just be smart about it.

- Car Dolly is easier on the tow truck than a car trailer
(The draw back with the RWD car is, you probably should remove the driveshaft)
- Always put an external oil cooler. Especially on a Dodge!!!!!!!!
- Check the hitch and ball for the class/max load. The lowest value you find it what you should do.
- Follow two limits of the vehicle.

-Go to the uhaul website, and select vehicle towing. There is an option to see "Will this work". This is a very good start to your research.


--- examples...

98 Dakota (Regular Cab 4x4) - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

98 Dakota (Regular Cab 4x4) - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer (2200lbs trailer) !!! Not recommended



2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)


2008 Toyota 4Runner 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 2dr

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)

2008 Toyota 4Runner 4x4 - 5000lbs hitch
- With a 1987 BMW 325 4Door

==============================
- Dolly Okay
- Car Trailer Okay (2200lbs trailer)
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Old 09-09-2013, 09:40 PM   #29
richie_s999
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Originally Posted by BigD View Post
Yup, with GVC
Off topic but how was the school, wanted to go but wasn't in the cards this year, defiantly interested for next summer
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Old 09-09-2013, 09:42 PM   #30
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Boosh... http://london.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehic...AdIdZ509561416
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