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Old 10-05-2011, 09:14 PM   #61
L8 Apexr
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Originally Posted by E30M42cab View Post
I think the best example was me making up an 8 second difference just with PAX running a HS car. I'm almost certain that I can drive my HS car faster than my FS car in real time, so it's win/win for me with the HS car. You'll never find a 40 second course with our club, so 13 seconds on a 1:30 - 2:00 course is certainly doable for you.
The time is relative,for an 80 second course I need to be 26 seconds faster-see the problem.

For example at the 2nd last event a well driven/prepped miata was the 2nd fastest car,I was 3 seconds faster and he happened to be #1 pax another 5 seconds clear of me.So that was 8 seconds I'd need to outrun him on pax on a 47 second course,tall order for a car with suspension and some other bits-its much worse with a stock class car.
How do you make a 1:30-2:00 course at the powerade center without being super slow tight hairpins everywhere?.

I was there this year for the ATTS solo event without wings,I had ftd with a run of just under 36 seconds.
Dot R's= no grip
http://youtu.be/r_opHgKNnfU

Much better with the hoosier slicks,it was the only run I made on them and I left a couple seconds out there.
http://youtu.be/8r8nhAWhCgs
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Old 10-06-2011, 12:10 AM   #62
E30M42cab
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Well, we do have tight technical sections, which is usually where these races are won and lost. Anyone can run long drawn out corners at high speed. It's the technical bits where braking and cornering momentum that leaves people behind, at least thats what I see from my experiece, which isn't that extensive. I've only ever run maybe 15 auto-x's in the last three years.

The course you're running in those two videos is so wide open! There's basically no technical sections at all. It's just tearing around a parking lot. I'd love to see the same course layout with the cones actually forming gates... that would be what we're more in tune with in our club. Figure 8's, lane change / bus stop gates, long straights with 90 degree turns at either end. That's how we make our runs longer. We're still getting up to 90kmh - 120kmh, but there's more to it than chucking the car around the course in second gear flat out.

That being said, I'd love to run a course like you just showed, where you just point and shoot with wreckless abandonment! Anyways, you'd probably enjoy our tighter courses without your aero. There's no miata's running with our club at the moment, but there is a E30 318i cabrio that will try to give you a hard time
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Old 10-06-2011, 12:23 AM   #63
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This is at our old lot, but don't really have much else to show you that our courses are much tighter. Oh, and we have stop cones at the end!

This is probably only my second or third auto-x, so yes, I hit some cones... this is before I knew what I was doing, but you'll see what I mean about a tighter course:
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Old 10-06-2011, 05:54 PM   #64
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Well, we do have tight technical sections, which is usually where these races are won and lost. Anyone can run long drawn out corners at high speed. It's the technical bits where braking and cornering momentum that leaves people behind, at least thats what I see from my experiece, which isn't that extensive. I've only ever run maybe 15 auto-x's in the last three years.

The course you're running in those two videos is so wide open! There's basically no technical sections at all. It's just tearing around a parking lot. I'd love to see the same course layout with the cones actually forming gates... that would be what we're more in tune with in our club. Figure 8's, lane change / bus stop gates, long straights with 90 degree turns at either end. That's how we make our runs longer. We're still getting up to 90kmh - 120kmh, but there's more to it than chucking the car around the course in second gear flat out.

That being said, I'd love to run a course like you just showed, where you just point and shoot with wreckless abandonment! Anyways, you'd probably enjoy our tighter courses without your aero. There's no miata's running with our club at the moment, but there is a E30 318i cabrio that will try to give you a hard time
Ha ha,thanks for the lesson.I've been autox'ing for 15 years,ontario class champ all 3 years I ran the series with no losses and a canadian national champ in a rented race car I'd never sat in.More event wins and FTD's than I can count.
The ATTS course was intended for the novice autox'ers that were targeted to run the event so yes it was far from technical,driving it at speed was far from just chucking the car around flat out in 2nd gear though.Sorry I make it look so easy.
Btw its just as much effort to keep a car at the limit in a sweeper as it is in a short radius turn.

That must be a hellava cabrio!,also since pax is based on more open course typical with the scca events pax gets skewed way towards the stock class on tight twisty courses.Simply not enough time to use a mod cars power/weight advantage and the slower speeds mean no areo.
As long as your courses don't look like the ones I've seen at PITL events I'll make the trip,simply not worth the fuel in the truck if they are.
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Old 10-06-2011, 07:35 PM   #65
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I'm not giving you a lesson, I'm just saying that in our club, a lot of people are new to auto-x, so picking lines through tight sections isn't something that comes easy to everyone. The straights/fast corners are really no different for a lot of cars, but the tight sections are where the more experieced guy can make up time, even with slower cars. I'm just comparing the course you showed on your video to the course on my video. Completely different. Basically, If we layed out a course like the one at the TWMC that you posted, you would destroy most of our guys. On one of our courses, you could forget about the aero parts, but you'd probably be given a little bit more of a run for your money. It's really hard to tell anything from onboard camera's though. Anyways, we look forward to you running with us next year if you're interested.

Are any of us welcome to attend any Twin Lakes auto-x next year? That Molson Centre lot looks pretty sweet! I'd love to come put a car through its paces out there!

BTW, no, the cabrio is nothing special obvously, but for a 20 year old 4 cylinder with no roof, it does alright for itself! I'd rather be running my coupe, but she doesn't work quite right at the moment. (and yes, you do make it look easy, but I would expect that from a purpose built moster like that!, and with 15 years experience, I should hope it's easy for you at this point! haha)
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Old 10-06-2011, 08:38 PM   #66
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No worries,btw TLMC events are open to everyone regardless of car prep.They use the casc classing system so every car has a class based on mods/tires.I'm not sure what you guys use for classing,can I get in the stock class?,I mean mines stock as its exactly the way it left the factory(my garage).

I'm sure I'll be down next year,I'll leave the wings on regardless-they are huge and start working at pretty low speeds,mostly help guide the car at slow speeds to keep from spinning.

On board vids generally make things seem slower,this bugger is pretty quick. (a typical M3 will need a min of 500hp to match power to weight)
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