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Old 07-02-2011, 12:52 AM   #31
sirex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
Who peed in your cup?
LOL, someone peed in my cup because I disagree with your argument which you claim as fact, or because I dislike your use of your sisters experiences as your main argument? You are stating your argument as a "factual point" and applying it to all situations, dont you find something inherently wrong with this?

Quote:

First I'm not "stereotyping" that is just something you made up.
See above. Applying a few experiences to the grand whole is a stereotype. Its the definition of the word.

Quote:
I also volunteered many hours at the hospital where my sister works having seen enough children living on the street, being thrown out by their parents or being in abusive situations. You can also read the Covenant House website if you like they are always looking for volunteers and donations
I am not really sure where you are going with this, you seem to be re-inforcing my point that just because you have a few experiences, it doesn't make it the driving force behind all kids with problems. As I said already I agree that in many situations the parenting is a problem, however, it's not the problem for every situation.

Quote:
But yes I am sticking to my point, when a stolen minivan driven by "kids" at 5am in the morning brutally kill a police officer I do think the parents are somehow responsible. Just many choose not to.
You make it sound as if the kids set out to murder a police officer that night. They had no intention of murder, what they did was manslaughter. Further more, we do not know the full story, we were not there that night. For all you know the kids in the minivan tried to run from the police officer and the police officer jumped infront of them. Does it make sense to you that he got dragged 300 meters or so into a ravine? Dont get me wrong, sucks at the loss of life, but police officers have alot of bravado and do stupid things sometimes.


Quote:
Like many parents choose not to stand by their kids to help them through drugs or alcohol addiction. Some parents choose to kick their kids out of the house because they can't deal with it any longer or are afraid of what the outside world might think. Every year over 40.000 runaway from home reports are filed! All i know is that happy kids don't runaway from home.
Cool. I am not sure how that related to any of the points I've made. In some cases kids chose to run away even with having loving/caring parents. There are so many situations and scenarios Im hard pressed to believe that everything goes back to the parents as being the root problem, but w/e thats your opinion and youre entitled to have it, though it's factual incorrect as I think most works in psychology have proben. Genetics, chemical imbalances, brain abnormalities, etc, etc all play a crucial role in the cognitive development and behavioural patterns.
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Old 07-02-2011, 09:43 AM   #32
misschigga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirex View Post
LOL, someone peed in my cup because I disagree with your argument which you claim as fact, or because I dislike your use of your sisters experiences as your main argument? You are stating your argument as a "factual point" and applying it to all situations, dont you find something inherently wrong with this?



See above. Applying a few experiences to the grand whole is a stereotype. Its the definition of the word.



I am not really sure where you are going with this, you seem to be re-inforcing my point that just because you have a few experiences, it doesn't make it the driving force behind all kids with problems. As I said already I agree that in many situations the parenting is a problem, however, it's not the problem for every situation.



You make it sound as if the kids set out to murder a police officer that night. They had no intention of murder, what they did was manslaughter. Further more, we do not know the full story, we were not there that night. For all you know the kids in the minivan tried to run from the police officer and the police officer jumped infront of them. Does it make sense to you that he got dragged 300 meters or so into a ravine? Dont get me wrong, sucks at the loss of life, but police officers have alot of bravado and do stupid things sometimes.




Cool. I am not sure how that related to any of the points I've made. In some cases kids chose to run away even with having loving/caring parents. There are so many situations and scenarios Im hard pressed to believe that everything goes back to the parents as being the root problem, but w/e thats your opinion and youre entitled to have it, though it's factual incorrect as I think most works in psychology have proben. Genetics, chemical imbalances, brain abnormalities, etc, etc all play a crucial role in the cognitive development and behavioural patterns.

WOW!!! the people i asked about you are right....you are sad! You did this at almost 1.00AM on a Friday night on a long weekend.
Anyways I guess you have no kids otherwise you would have tried to understand me better. Thank god for the 15 yr old we don't know much about the case because by law he's protected because he's a minor. At that age you just suck at making decisions. Many times after a school i have a bunch of 14yr old's in the house that come home with my oldest. The things some of these kids say LOL you just know they are not ready to act or behave like grown ups. Pretending to be all tough LOL

In a way i wish you were right about it not being the parents fault sometimes because that would make it somewhat better, unfortunately and yes I am speaking from what I have seen first hand, a lot of these trouble teens have parents that worry more about the amount of alcohol in the cabinet then what their son is up to, or are just too busy working and suffering to pay that huge mortgage then to pay attention to their child's life and as long there are people out there turning a blind eye and just blame it on the kid just being a devil's brew these things might happen. You have any idea how many teens are on behavioral drugs? It's sad
Canada doesn't offer enough help, there isn't enough funding for support.

Anyways, time for the beach, going to cramp a bunch of kids and a dog in the 318 how cruel is that?

Ow BTW why do you drive a vw?
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Old 07-02-2011, 10:19 AM   #33
sirex
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Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
WOW!!! the people i asked about you are right....you are sad! You did this at almost 1.00AM on a Friday night on a long weekend.
lol, Im sad? How so? You don't have any idea of my current situation. I see we're still resorting to personal attacks to gain an "edge" on arguments though, instead of sticking at the discussion at hand. I guess you took my point that using arguments that aren't yours was taken as a personal insult.

Quote:
Anyways I guess you have no kids otherwise you would have tried to understand me better.
I dont see how this has anything to do with mental development. Cool though.

Quote:
Thank god for the 15 yr old we don't know much about the case because by law he's protected because he's a minor.
True, though I dont know if we should thank god about that. It be good to know what actaully happened.

Quote:

At that age you just suck at making decisions.
WAIT, WAIT, WAIT... Hold up here.. Lets re wind... You now are saying TEENS suck at making their own decisions?

Thats funny. I thought the parent was responsible for the bad decisions their children make.


Quote:
Many times after a school i have a bunch of 14yr old's in the house that come home with my oldest. The things some of these kids say LOL you just know they are not ready to act or behave like grown ups. Pretending to be all tough LOL
wait, wait more? more re-inforcement that 14 year old kids/teens make their own decisions and chose the words that they say? Maybe their decision making skills are influenced alot more by their peers, social class, media, rather than just their parents? No it can't be. Someone that vehemently believes its the parents fault?


Quote:
In a way i wish you were right about it not being the parents fault sometimes because that would make it somewhat better,
Lol, what are you trying to say here? We know for a fact that not every situation is the same, and that not every situation can be attributed back to the parents. It doesn't make it better that its not the parents fault. In fact it doesn't make it better regardless. It's still a problem.


Quote:
unfortunately and yes I am speaking from what I have seen first hand, a lot of these trouble teens have parents that worry more about the amount of alcohol in the cabinet then what their son is up to,
Yep, cool. See previous posts. I have already said that I agree in many situations bad parenting is the factor. However as I already said its not the only reason that kids misbehave, etc. Many kids can have perfect parents and still turn out to be bad.



Quote:
or are just too busy working and suffering to pay that huge mortgage then to pay attention to their child's life and as long there are people out there turning a blind eye and just blame it on the kid just being a devil's brew these things might happen.
I think you mis-understood the concept of the devils brew, which you now have used several times in your posts but I dont think you've fully comprehended the use of the wording.

You can have perfect parents and the kids grow up in perfect families, and yet still turn out to have behavioural issues, and can be mischeivous, and do bad things, etc. This is in reference to a devils brew, in which case even with perfect parents the kid still needs to make a mess out of things.


Quote:
You have any idea how many teens are on behavioral drugs?
Wow, so now, you went from blaming the parents to the up-bringing of children, to blaming underlieing chemical imbalances??

Do you know why teens are on behavioural drugs? Because of genetics and also due to chemical imbalances. Chemical imbalances that cause children to behave irratically and different from the norm. These drugs are not taken because their PARENTS are bad, but are taken because of GENETIC ABNORMALITIES, CHEMICAL IMBALANCES, and other issues.


Quote:
It's sad
Yes, it is sad. But unless we genetically engineer our kids to be perfect, then its going to keep happening. This is why there are so many studies in psychology. this is why chemistry is important. Making drugs to create solutions for these problems that are not due to the parents, but due to genetics, etc.

Quote:
Canada doesn't offer enough help, there isn't enough funding for support.
Cool.


Quote:
Anyways, time for the beach, going to cramp a bunch of kids and a dog in the 318 how cruel is that?

Ow BTW why do you drive a vw?
Because its what I can afford at the moment and it was free.

Why do you drive a 318?
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Old 07-04-2011, 04:58 PM   #34
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Im with sirex on this one. as I said its not even remotely close to being black and white issue. i can think of a few families off the top of my head who have great kids and the odd trouble maker. in fact thats pretty typical of the avg family....and thats with good parents/upbringing.

I also know of the parents out there that are extremely lucky to not have a difficult child to deal with ..then they stand on their soap box about how its all how well they brought them up and that anyone with a difficult child is doing it wrong. LOL talk about ignorant.

You can be the best parents around and still end up with a difficult child.
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Old 07-04-2011, 08:26 PM   #35
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Okay, I can't just sit and read any more. sirex is mostly right IMO. misschigga.....Somethings can be attributed to the parenting of the child, but not all. I'm a Father, but my daughter isn't 15. I am not that old, and can remember my teen age years fairly well, and I remember being an idiot. I made the worst decisions possible. My parents were not, and are not alcoholics, but coming from Scotland, drinking is the social way, and that's how they drank. When I was a teen, I drank socially, which was often, but being a teen, and not being wise towards life, I drank way too much and got into trouble. I see that being part my fault, and part my parents fault for getting into the habit of drinking that way. The decision however was totally mine. They only thing I think we take from our parents is our attitudes towards things, and others. Even then we have a choice to act that way. Even a teen can make that decision.
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Old 07-05-2011, 06:53 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by craigIS View Post
Okay, I can't just sit and read any more. sirex is mostly right IMO. misschigga.....Somethings can be attributed to the parenting of the child, but not all. I'm a Father, but my daughter isn't 15. I am not that old, and can remember my teen age years fairly well, and I remember being an idiot. I made the worst decisions possible. My parents were not, and are not alcoholics, but coming from Scotland, drinking is the social way, and that's how they drank. When I was a teen, I drank socially, which was often, but being a teen, and not being wise towards life, I drank way too much and got into trouble. I see that being part my fault, and part my parents fault for getting into the habit of drinking that way. The decision however was totally mine. They only thing I think we take from our parents is our attitudes towards things, and others. Even then we have a choice to act that way. Even a teen can make that decision.
Ugh! this has become a heavy conversation where i think i'm being totally misunderstood but oh well! Just a question though, If your parents had interfered and helped you out when your drinking got out of hand and i assume that was when you were still younger then 18, would you life have been different?
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Old 07-05-2011, 09:28 PM   #37
sirex
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Well, I disassembled all that you wrote down to the core sentences for that reason: to understand you, and I think I did a great job at it.

As for parents interfering: hindsight, as they say, is 20/20. If you had made a LEFT turn instead of a RIGHT turn, would your life be different MissChiga? If you got A+ all through high school, would your life be different? Was that your parents fault too? Is it your parents fault that instead of studying for 24 hours straight, you only studied 3? I mean where do you draw the line with what youre saying?? Eseentially what youre saying is all behaviour comes to the underlying parenting.

What about after the age of 18? Is there some sort of white line at the age of 18? I am not really sure where you're going with this. What if you were 30, and had no history of criminal behaviour, etc, and then suddenly lashed out? Does it still come down to your parenting?

Also, Im not quite sure why you keep beating a dead horse here. We've already agreed that parenting does have a significant role to play. The only thing we can't agree on, and I know I have not misunderstood you is that you believe its 100% the parents fault, no ifs, buts, etc.
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Old 07-06-2011, 09:18 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by sirex View Post
Well, I disassembled all that you wrote down to the core sentences for that reason: to understand you, and I think I did a great job at it.

As for parents interfering: hindsight, as they say, is 20/20. If you had made a LEFT turn instead of a RIGHT turn, would your life be different MissChiga? If you got A+ all through high school, would your life be different? Was that your parents fault too? Is it your parents fault that instead of studying for 24 hours straight, you only studied 3? I mean where do you draw the line with what youre saying?? Eseentially what youre saying is all behaviour comes to the underlying parenting.

What about after the age of 18? Is there some sort of white line at the age of 18? I am not really sure where you're going with this. What if you were 30, and had no history of criminal behaviour, etc, and then suddenly lashed out? Does it still come down to your parenting?

Also, Im not quite sure why you keep beating a dead horse here. We've already agreed that parenting does have a significant role to play. The only thing we can't agree on, and I know I have not misunderstood you is that you believe its 100% the parents fault, no ifs, buts, etc.
Was i talking to you? NO so therefor keep your sticky keyboard fingers to yourself.
First of all learn to spell or use spell check your posts are annoying as it is and if i have to read through that sloppy writing of yours makes it even worse.
Second nobody knows you so therefor nobody cares what you say or what your opinion is.
Third, you are mostly posting in "off-topic" you hardly contribute to any other technical area's and you probably don't contribute to any of the businesses that advertise on here, you are here to stir shit and get under people's skin. You are always negative and complaining and I'm surprised you haven't been banned yet since you don't contribute and just trash. You have been here since 2002 maybe you should change your name to "king shit talker" It's bad enough you took this thread for the fallen police officer and trashed it by taking everything i said out of context. When i said "some parents" you made it look like into "all parents". I guess when you can't spell you can't read.
Anyways I assume (read properly i assume means that's what i think but don't know for sure) you still live with your parents, you're professional student (aka as bum) nobody ever calls you because you have no friends because of your sour personality and the internet is all the life you have. have a nice day Sirex! From now on I choose not to read your posts anymore

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Old 07-06-2011, 10:02 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
Was i talking to you? NO so therefor keep your sticky keyboard fingers to yourself.
First of all learn to spell or use spell check your posts are annoying as it is and if i have to read through that sloppy writing of yours makes it even worse.
Second nobody knows you so therefor nobody cares what you say or what your opinion is.
Third, you are mostly posting in "off-topic" you hardly contribute to any other technical area's and you probably don't contribute to any of the businesses that advertise on here, you are here to stir shit and get under people's skin. You are always negative and complaining and I'm surprised you haven't been banned yet since you don't contribute and just trash. You have been here since 2002 maybe you should change your name to "king shit talker" It's bad enough you took this thread for the fallen police officer and trashed it by taking everything i said out of context. When i said "some parents" you made it look like into "all parents". I guess when you can't spell you can't read.
Anyways I assume (read properly i assume means that's what i think but don't know for sure) you still live with your parents, you're professional student (aka as bum) nobody ever calls you because you have no friends because of your sour personality and the internet is all the life you have. have a nice day Sirex! From now on I choose not to read your posts anymore
checkmate.
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Old 07-06-2011, 10:39 AM   #40
damameke
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Sirex.. its your parent's fault that you still lives with them..lol
and just becos you love to learn, you are characterised as a professional
student... no wait a minute ...a bum...

I suggest that you stop posting....your postings allows one to form what a lonely sour person you are ....lol...

find a hole and hibernate.....
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:31 AM   #41
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Maybe I'm not understanding you, the way you intend. If not, then break it down more please. To answer your question, yes, my life would be different if my parents interfered with my drinking habits when I was a teen. It would have caused me to make at least one major different decision, at least once. Which would have more than likely lead me down a different path in life. I blame things, on people, like myself, because I made the decisions as a teen, knowing that the things I was doing were illegal. It wasn't just drinking, I stole, I bullied, beat kids up (sometimes), did drug, not just pot. I made those decisions, to partake in those activities. I should now also say, that I don't regret any of it! It made me turn out the way I am, and apart from a few things, I happy with who I am. Because of the decision I made, it helped me to understand what some kids go through, because I've done most of it. Basically, My 'rents could have influenced a decision, but ultimately I was the one behind the wheel, and I chose to make the decision, whether it was what my 'rents wanted or not.
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Old 07-06-2011, 01:51 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by craigIS View Post
Maybe I'm not understanding you, the way you intend. If not, then break it down more please. To answer your question, yes, my life would be different if my parents interfered with my drinking habits when I was a teen. It would have caused me to make at least one major different decision, at least once. Which would have more than likely lead me down a different path in life. I blame things, on people, like myself, because I made the decisions as a teen, knowing that the things I was doing were illegal. It wasn't just drinking, I stole, I bullied, beat kids up (sometimes), did drug, not just pot. I made those decisions, to partake in those activities. I should now also say, that I don't regret any of it! It made me turn out the way I am, and apart from a few things, I happy with who I am. Because of the decision I made, it helped me to understand what some kids go through, because I've done most of it. Basically, My 'rents could have influenced a decision, but ultimately I was the one behind the wheel, and I chose to make the decision, whether it was what my 'rents wanted or not.
i really appreciate the way you explained it here and it means you understand what i'm talking about because you have been there. Like you I also believe no kid should ever put the blame on their parents. You were be able to recognize and turn around but I just can't help it to feel bad for a lot of kids being stuck in certain situations where there is "no return" I agree it's the teen who's making the decision to do something stupid but as a parent i would feel i failed at being a parent because i should have known better because they suck at making decisions and i would feel responsible for their actions. Maybe it's just me who thinks like that.
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Old 07-06-2011, 02:21 PM   #43
sirex
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Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
Was i talking to you? NO so therefor keep your sticky keyboard fingers to yourself.
First of all learn to spell or use spell check your posts are annoying as it is and if i have to read through that sloppy writing of yours makes it even worse.
Second nobody knows you so therefor nobody cares what you say or what your opinion is.
Third, you are mostly posting in "off-topic" you hardly contribute to any other technical area's and you probably don't contribute to any of the businesses that advertise on here, you are here to stir shit and get under people's skin. You are always negative and complaining and I'm surprised you haven't been banned yet since you don't contribute and just trash. You have been here since 2002 maybe you should change your name to "king shit talker" It's bad enough you took this thread for the fallen police officer and trashed it by taking everything i said out of context. When i said "some parents" you made it look like into "all parents". I guess when you can't spell you can't read.
Anyways I assume (read properly i assume means that's what i think but don't know for sure) you still live with your parents, you're professional student (aka as bum) nobody ever calls you because you have no friends because of your sour personality and the internet is all the life you have. have a nice day Sirex! From now on I choose not to read your posts anymore


LOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO LOLOLOLOL OLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLOLOLOOOLOOOOLOLOLOLOLLO OLOOOOOL

LOLOLOL

I should learn to spell. LOLOLOL

PS it's spelt THEREFORE. THEREFORE, it's not that hard. OH ya, you should also capitalize the I's. If youre going to insult peoples spelling and punctuation, PLEASE do a better job your self. Every sentence that you've written in this thread is broke/framented without commas, poorly worded/written.

PSS. I don't know you either. But I guess when people get PWNED cause they dont know how to write out and express their opinions, ITS EVERYONE elses fault?? LOL.

Funny thing is I was pretty fair in my discussion. You're the one that attacked me first.

PSSS. Me, being a student, has landed me a job making 45K a year ENTRY LEVEL, WITH BONUSES, WITH full benefits. Who's the bum now? Have fun driving your shitty 318.

PSSSS. If you didn't want a response from the Maxbimmers community you could have PMED him.

PSSSSS. I dont contribute to the technicals because I have nothing to add. I wasn't aware I had to add to the technical portion of this website to be here. Maybe you should be come a moderator???? Oh wait, you dont have the level headed attitude to really be one. You just lost your shit in a thread in which YOU TWISTED what I said/Misunderstood what I said, and now are telling me that I didn't understand LOL.


I GUESS YOU WIN MISSSCHIGA, YOU HAVE THE LAST WORDZ
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Old 07-06-2011, 02:27 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
The sad fact is parents are responsible and saying that your kid is just a devil's brew is turning a blind eye or giving up your responsibility.

This is my LAST WORD. WINner.
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Old 07-06-2011, 05:04 PM   #45
SiR
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Originally Posted by misschigga View Post
Was i talking to you? NO so therefor keep your sticky keyboard fingers to yourself.
First of all learn to spell or use spell check your posts are annoying as it is and if i have to read through that sloppy writing of yours makes it even worse.
Second nobody knows you so therefor nobody cares what you say or what your opinion is.
Third, you are mostly posting in "off-topic" you hardly contribute to any other technical area's and you probably don't contribute to any of the businesses that advertise on here, you are here to stir shit and get under people's skin. You are always negative and complaining and I'm surprised you haven't been banned yet since you don't contribute and just trash. You have been here since 2002 maybe you should change your name to "king shit talker" It's bad enough you took this thread for the fallen police officer and trashed it by taking everything i said out of context. When i said "some parents" you made it look like into "all parents". I guess when you can't spell you can't read.
Anyways I assume (read properly i assume means that's what i think but don't know for sure) you still live with your parents, you're professional student (aka as bum) nobody ever calls you because you have no friends because of your sour personality and the internet is all the life you have. have a nice day Sirex! From now on I choose not to read your posts anymore
what the heck does this have to do with the issue/argument/debate?


I mean if you dont have any other points to add or rebuttal with, thats fine. But why a personal attack that means nothing what so ever?

So what if no body knows him? Spelling?Who cares if he doesnt post anywhere else? How is any of that relevant to the topic at hand?
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