Cold Start Rattle - Video Included

Tutankhamon · 02-23-2011, 05:00 PM

I've been chasing the same rattle for quite some time now and it's starting to drive me crazy. I'm hoping somebody can shed some light on what this might be. It sounds like a metallic rattle of some sort.

It happens only on cold starts, and once the car warms up it'll never happen. The sound also never happens right at idle, only at the beginning of a rev. It feels like it needs some sort of load or something in order to make it happen so either a sudden rev or if I shift into gear and begin to pull away.

The window of opportunity to hear it is very limited as the car warms up fairly quickly.

I just had an oil change a couple days ago. Car has just over 200k km . It's an '02 330ci. Catback exhaust, headers have not been changed. WP was changed maybe 100k km ago to a metal empeller one. Belts are new.

Could it be tensioner? vanos? Clutch? It sounds like it's coming more from the passenger side, in the engine bay.

The rattle can be heard right at 0:40, 0:43, 0:47, 0:52, 1:01, and 1:10 - pretty much any time I rev it.

Help

Tutankhamon · 02-24-2011, 11:51 AM

Took another video today, I think I'm getting closer

This time I sat in the passenger seat and had the camera down below the passenger side skirt. As I revved the car, this rattle/metallic chirp could be heard a lot more clearly. I really do feel like it's coming from down below, and definitely more pronounced closer to the passenger side.

Here is the video:

Pierce330 · 02-25-2011, 08:37 PM

You might want to lift the car...I had a rattle and it turned out to be a bracket...bought the part from the dealer and changed it myself...15 mins...doesn't sound like anything too serious...

Ceeker · 02-25-2011, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tutankhamon

I've been chasing the same rattle for quite some time now and it's starting to drive me crazy. I'm hoping somebody can shed some light on what this might be. It sounds like a metallic rattle of some sort.

It happens only on cold starts, and once the car warms up it'll never happen. The sound also never happens right at idle, only at the beginning of a rev. It feels like it needs some sort of load or something in order to make it happen so either a sudden rev or if I shift into gear and begin to pull away.

The window of opportunity to hear it is very limited as the car warms up fairly quickly.

I just had an oil change a couple days ago. Car has just over 200k km . It's an '02 330ci. Catback exhaust, headers have not been changed. WP was changed maybe 100k km ago to a metal empeller one. Belts are new.

Could it be tensioner? vanos? Clutch? It sounds like it's coming more from the passenger side, in the engine bay.

The rattle can be heard right at 0:40, 0:43, 0:47, 0:52, 1:01, and 1:10 - pretty much any time I rev it.

Help

My e30 vert is doing the same thing; at idle does nothing as soon as I rev it a bit the rattle starts. Sounds like the car is pinging really bad.

Found out it is most likely the tensioner.

Tutankhamon · 02-28-2011, 09:54 AM

Well I was hoping it was a simple exhaust mount but I have a feeling that it's a bit more than that.

Couple days ago, my check engine light came on. I got it read and cleared and it threw a P0365 Camshaft position sensor bank 1 (I believe it's exhaust side, somebody please correct me if I'm wrong).

I also got my g/f to help me take a video with the hood open and I have a pretty good feeling that it's a clunking of some sort coming from the front of the engine from the vanos area.

Here is yet another video, let me know what you guys think:

My main question is, this just doesn't sound like the typical vanos sound to me, maybe more of a chain tensioner or something, could either of those be related to a CPS CEL?

I'm booking an appointment to take it in today.

EDIT: One thing I'd like to add is the CEL is back on now, and the car seems to have lost quite a bit of torque in the lower rpm ranges

xlr8nbimbo · 02-28-2011, 08:57 PM

Take it to TechMax. Atillla or Tony will figure it out for you and you won't get screwed. And by the way, mine is quite noisy on a cold wintery morning until it warms up. Then it's just fine. Have a beer and relax.

new member · 03-02-2011, 08:02 PM

DO you know what Vanos, DISA are ?

If not, bring it to RMP and let them diagnose it.

xlr8nbimbo · 03-03-2011, 04:27 PM

I listened to the clattering in your video. I had a brand new Subaru a few years ago that had that exact sound - ended up being "piston slap". Regardless, take it and get it diagnosed by an expert. There are good suggestions above. Let us know what it ends up being.

Tutankhamon · 03-21-2011, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by new member

DO you know what Vanos, DISA are ?

If not, bring it to RMP and let them diagnose it.

The DISA is on the opposite side of the engine from where this sound is originating, that's why I didn't think that was the culprit. It really does sound like it's coming from the Vanos area. I ordered the beisan seals and will likely be getting those replaced. I'm gonna replace the VCG while in there, but I was wondering if I should also replace the chain tensioner?

new member · 03-22-2011, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tutankhamon

The DISA is on the opposite side of the engine from where this sound is originating, that's why I didn't think that was the culprit. It really does sound like it's coming from the Vanos area. I ordered the beisan seals and will likely be getting those replaced. I'm gonna replace the VCG while in there, but I was wondering if I should also replace the chain tensioner?

No need to replace the chain tensioners, neither the main nor the secondary. Its not something thats considered a maintenance item with our cars.

Plus you dont need to touch them when doing the work you described. Main chain tensioner will almost never go bad as its a simple threaded piece and secondary tensioner may break/go bad only if you let it loose (ex. while changing cams)

Tutankhamon · 03-22-2011, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by new member

No need to replace the chain tensioners, neither the main nor the secondary. Its not something thats considered a maintenance item with our cars.

Plus you dont need to touch them when doing the work you described. Main chain tensioner will almost never go bad as its a simple threaded piece and secondary tensioner may break/go bad only if you let it loose (ex. while changing cams)

Thanks for the info!

I pray that it's just the vanos seals then. I got the seals on their way, should be here within the next few days. Got a new vanos gasket as well as a new VCG that I'll want to put in at the same time. Is there anything else I'm forgetting or that should be worth doing while it's opened up?

new member · 03-23-2011, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tutankhamon

Is there anything else I'm forgetting or that should be worth doing while it's opened up?

No, not really. I mean you could replace different gaskets and washers, like the ones on the VANOS banjo oil line, the gaskets for the bolts on the VCG (those rubber rings), but it snot a necessity. I never had to replace either of these and had no issues.

jabela · 03-23-2011, 01:34 PM

Looking forward to hearing if this fixes your problem.

Tutankhamon · 04-04-2011, 12:37 PM

Quick update, just got my Beisan seals in the mail, making an appointment for everything this week, will report back with my findings.

Tutankhamon · 04-18-2011, 11:40 AM

Well just to update this thread, I had my vanos seals replaced along with the VCG. The car is running just like new, engine looked great when opened up which made me really happy to see.

Bad news is the rattle is still there on cold starts. Back to the drawing board I guess.