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Old 05-01-2010, 08:09 AM   #31
richie_s999
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Originally Posted by black bnr32 View Post
Probably says it in the bimmerforums thread; I just can't remember off the top of my head. I'm sure you could call Miller and find out as it seems to be one of their standard MS3 builds.
A car with that kinda power could be a killer on long sweeping turns and strait aways with a long set of gears! BUt without knowing what its built for who knows, could just be built to show how much power they can make.
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Old 05-01-2010, 08:44 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by NOTORIOUS VR View Post
^^^ glad you decided to go that way. Just remember that if you just swap to an "I" head (885 casting) with the E bottom end the compression will be pretty low, so matching a turbo will be ever so more important.

That said, it's been done many times and if you want to go that way do it! Just don't bother with chips and RRFPR's. Go standalone or if your willing talk to MarkD on here and get a tune the proper way and never look back.

Also check out e30tech.com.

Good luck!
for sure i'm going to talk to mark D... as i was doing research over at revlimited and e30tech i was shocked at how many posts people mention Mark D and his tuning and chips..
LOL we got a celebrity in our forums
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Old 05-01-2010, 09:23 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by richie_s999 View Post
Seriously your saying that by adding more presure and heat your not adding strain on internal parts?
No I never said that. But you clearly don't believe that an NA motor is under stress either.

Quote:
I'm not trying to knock boost, and either I,m not getting my point out in a way you understand it, or you just have you mind made up that boost is better cause thats what you like.
Yes you are knocking boost. And you're not getting your point across because you keep changing "your" point.

Quote:
done properly yes a boosted car will be reliable, its all up to the internals being upgraded to match the pressure, then deal with the heat caused by putting the ait under presure, intercooler, piping turbo or SC, and what ever other verity of added systems you need to add to keep things cool.
Ok, so what's the problem? Why did you even bring up "stress" in this thread?

Quote:
after all is said and done you've added alot of weight to the front of your car, inturn upseting the weight balance (something BMW is good for) and then have to adjust things out by changing spring rates and what not to get your handling back. I could really piss you off and we could start to talk about the advantage of RWD vs FWD or AWD and how it affects a car in anything but a strait line!!!
BMW seems to manage just fine with weight distribution on their cars with FI, so I really don't get what point you're trying to make at this point? If someone who is building a car is really worried about weight distribution after the fact getting set of custom spring rates, valved dampers and throwing it on a scale isn't that big of a deal. Also most of the time the extra mass from the turbo components are in the middle of the car. Example, an M20 turbo E30 might weigh the same as an M30 swapped E30, but the M20 will have less weight over the front wheels.

Quote:
Please don't add something to things I have said, I never compaired a V8 to a 4 pot, thats twisting someones words.
I'm not twisting words, you made a general blanket statement. I gave an example. You can't just say a boosted motor is under more stress and give certain parameters.

Quote:
As for New cars going smaller dispacement and adding boost for power, everyone who has been following things knows this is only to meet goverment regualtions which are getting SO outa hand its crazy. Its costing THOUSANDS more to produce cars to meet standards just laid out for the upcoming years, and the enviroment minister is actually trying to tell people that the $5000 plus its gonna cost them to get a car that meets the standard is going to come back to them in fuel savings over 5 years? but thats another thread!
That's part of it you're right, but it's an example I had to provide.

Quote:
Now back to what I actully said, yes dyno numbers Do NOTshow what a car will actually do on the street/track or anything but how much power its getting to the wheels. They are a measurement of what the motor is producing and how much power loss the driveline is taking.....THATS IT
I never said different. But you were talking about TQ, and how it drops off at high RPM with a boosted motor, which is just incorrect. This just went off course when you were trying to defend your original statement.

Quote:
True numbers of performance come from skid pad, acceleration test, track times, all of which show how all the cars components are working to actually use what ever power your making.
Really who ever said different... but really there are a lot more to the tests you mentioned because of the many environmental variables (just like with any test) and lol skid pad... one of the useless tests ever since it's mainly a test of the tires not of suspension.

Quote:
you,ve got some good dyno numbers and drag slip times in your sig, but I know enough that its only reliative to showing some factors of performance.
My car originally makes one of the flattest TQ curves in the industry, it was actually one of the first to do that! the 335 is another good example of this.

They both make lots of TQ and HP "under the curve" which makes the FASTER then their numbers suggest. There is a reason to this though and it comes to component choice.

Quote:
Someone just told me the other day about his times at Mosport, he had previously been running a VW with about 8G's of properly done mods under the hood, and when he got his first BMW, a E36 328, he took off 4 seconds of his track time the first time out with a bone stock car.
While that might be true for the person who you talked to, I find it hard to believe that is an absolute. Either he spent the money wrong on that car or started with the wrong platform to begin with in the motor dept. Mosport is a pretty "fast" track.

[quotw]I,m not trying to tell anyone not to boost a car, but like I said in mu origional post, show me the tourque, and how your using it, and getting it to actully make the car faster!!![/quote]

I give up.
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Old 05-01-2010, 09:35 AM   #34
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LOL, cant compare a vdub to a BMW, the bmw is at home at the track naturally in it's stock form (Look at John)

As for useable TQ, I should give you a ride In my car some day, My car is not like your typical youtube E30 where it gets going at 5k+, There's tons of usable TQ and power...Heck I don't even get that much wheelspin!

Look at this dyno of a M30B35 on 8.5psi;



300+whp @ 3500rpms? seems usable to me!

As far as the TQ dropoff thats just the natural poor VE of the m30, a turbo cam would help that out. On M5X motors boosted they keep the power going all the way to redline in most cases since its got 12 more valves.

As for weight dist. It's simple, go bottom mount. 99% of the time the weight of the turbo is behind the front axle you've sucessfully moved the weight of the A/C compressor towards the rear of the car = distrubitionz
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Old 05-01-2010, 09:40 AM   #35
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Here's another example:



Again usable TQ from about 3.5k (you wouldn't be spinning any lower on a track right?) and peak HP right up at 6k....500+whp up there seems linear enough

that was on a stock s52 @ 16psi with just a 61mm turbo btw.
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Old 05-01-2010, 11:44 AM   #36
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There's no point in even arguing with the guy.

Engines are so damn inefficient, everyone should know this. So increasing the VE for basically "free" by the use of a gas driven turbine when the right components are selected makes all of his points he's trying to argue null and void.
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Old 05-01-2010, 12:36 PM   #37
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Richie, have you owned a big power FI car before? just curious.
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Old 05-02-2010, 09:59 AM   #38
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Piping in a little late, but anyway,M30 all the way,since they make nasty torque and adding a turbo adds even more torque.
M30's are to simple,stock mid 80s engines are the right compression, timing chain, no belt. There are a ton of them, if you blow it up, so what,local yard run and you are back in the game. AS far as weight,stock the m30 is 60 pounds heavier than stock e30 engines.My turbo T04B .81 AR. is low slung behind front axle,3 in exhaust front to back.all air condition piping,compressors weight gone.No clutch fan. I use the stock air condition circuit to engage aux fan during in town low speed driving,72C thermostat. I dumped stock calipers for wilwood dynalites and rotors, 750i master cylinder(moves 18 % more fluid), bilsteins,eibach ground control, electromotive tec2 standalone,225 50 15 basket weaves,no 5 lug swap thats weight 3.25 Lsd
87 325is. Beauty is more than skin deep on this bitch.

this site is older i believe check it out.
http://cartech.net/bmwm30turbo.htm
my exhaust manifold,turbo,waste gate are one in the same.
you can see other packages as well and some numbers.

I am going to try and make some meets soon ,just finishing up some winter projects on the old girl. Mister
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Old 05-02-2010, 03:18 PM   #39
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I was going to mention that my stock motor does well.. it purrs like a kitty.. Have the same car as you Mister except I didn't motor swap. I'm going to not boost it till I know I get all the right parts for it before I go half ass the job and end up blowing up a valve or something.
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Old 05-03-2010, 10:27 AM   #40
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Mister and E30_kid89, both guys I know who have actually taken the time to build there turbo cars the right way, cool part is they booth went same rought with out ever meeting each other, they are great guys and dont' FORCE their opions and I respect them for that.

Notorious VR...seriously your pushing the limits of what an argument or dicussion even is, your right in saying their is not point arguing, but thats because you ignorant to anything you don't think is the best way to go, so just drop it and go have fun with your over powered audi and usless drivline system, you really want to prove how great you car is come to the autocrosses, and show us, other wise can it.

Black bnrn, No i have never personally owned a FI car, but driving many many many of them. Ive been around since you first got a 365 learners permit instead of a graduated one, and I,m not going to start spouting off all the cars I have driven in and been around and involved with.

I'm done, you like boosted cars thats cool, I like na cars but I can repect booth, and don't tell me I am wrong about things cause you opion is different, thats being ignorant.

Have a good day, i'm outa here!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-03-2010, 07:52 PM   #41
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go have fun with your over powered audi and usless drivline system, you really want to prove how great you car is come to the autocrosses, and show us, other wise can it.
Whoaaaaaaaaa! Not being a dick or anything but, I'm calling this one out.
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Old 05-03-2010, 08:25 PM   #42
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no such thing as over powered, but there is always underpowered
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Old 05-03-2010, 09:24 PM   #43
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off topic, but are you trying to sell your car NOTORIOUS VR
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:20 PM   #44
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didn't read the whole thread, but, if interested, i am selling a S50 currently. PM me for details
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Old 08-05-2010, 09:44 PM   #45
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I have an m30 full swap, plus mounts exhaust and drive shaft. send me a pm for details
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