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Old 02-03-2010, 11:25 AM   #1
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How Gun Registration and Confiscation Works in Canada



or cops don't want anybody to own guns?

Quote:

The cops came and took my gun

A pounding at the door the other morning; my windows rattled. I was upstairs at work. I don't always leave my desk to hear the good news about Jehovah.

The pounder was insistent. I went down, if only for the sake of the windows.

Oh, jeeze, the cops.

Officers Firth and Kozar in attendance. "What's up, boys?" My preference was to talk to them through the plate glass door. They wanted to come inside.

Not a chance.

I stepped onto the porch. Who wants two armed strangers in his house, and anyway it was a nice morning.

Officer K. said, "Are you aware of Project Safe City?" I hate it when a guy answers a question with a question.

"Why do you want to know?"

Officer K. said, "We have reason to believe you have a firearm." Oh, here we go again.

The last time a representative of the city showed up at my door, she had reason to believe I had a cat. How did she know? The lady cat cop peered through the window at my curtains and said, "Cat hair."

I dislike being spied on.

I also dislike armed men at the door. And then Officer K. mispronounced my name and asked if I still worked for this newspaper.

Hmm. He'd clearly done some research on me, and I had none on him, nor was I sure why my place of employment was important.

I asked Officer K. if he'd mind getting to the point. He thought I was being difficult. Not me. I am, however, uncomfortable playing 20 Questions in the morning with armed men on the porch.

The point?

Officer K. reminded me that my firearms licence had expired. He said I could turn the gun over to them for storage, or they could take the gun and destroy it.

My gun? It is a single-barrel .20 gauge shotgun. It is 40 years old. I used to take it into the woods up north to get partridge in the fall.

The last time I used it, I was walking along a hydro cut when I surprised a deer in the long dry grass. She leapt away in slow motion, flanks rippling, nostrils flaring; too beautiful.

I haven't hunted since.

I own no shells.

But it's my gun, dammit. I guess, when the Feds began the long-gun registry, I should have lied and not bothered to register the damn thing.

Officer K. pressed me about turning the gun over, there and then, for storage or destruction. For a brief moment I thought about handing it over, if only to get rid of him and his pal.

And then it just seemed wrong:

A couple of cops show up at my door, unannounced, and the talkative one says he has reason to believe, and I'm supposed to hand over my property just like that?

I hate to write this.

I know who's going to respond and how. Let me be clear: I am not one of those "pry it out of my cold, dead hands" guys. No one in the city but a copper ought to have a handgun. And so on.

But I am a fellow who grew up in Northern Ontario and who was once the scourge of the clay pigeon, feared among the partridges.

I told Officer K. I would not hand my gun over and he could take the next step, whatever that might be, and close the gate on the way out.

Did I think they were aggressive? Yes. Was my response temperate? Not especially.

An hour later Officers F. and K. showed up with their boss, Officer Nicolle. He was as angry as he was pushy and he said he wanted the gun or he'd come back with a search warrant.

I was offered no options.

No one ever said, look, you have to renew your licence; we'll give you two weeks, here's the paperwork you need; and in two weeks, if you don't have the licence we'll have to ask you for the gun.

In the absence of options, faced with a search warrant and outnumbered three to one, I said I'd get the damn shotgun.

Officer N. got in my face then and said, using his outdoor voice, "Don't you bring up any loaded firearms."

As if, copper.

I presume my gun's in storage now. The receipt does not say where or for how long.

Aren't you glad the city's safer?


http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/arti...ok-my-gun?bn=1
so they knew he was a reporter
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Old 02-03-2010, 12:09 PM   #2
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This reporter was being difficult - probably had writers block and needed something to write for his column. Don't be a dick to cops, they won't be dicks to you.

I can understand not wanting to open the door for strangers, but uniformed police officers? If he had opened the door or stepped out on the front porch to have a discussion with them it would have gone down much differently. The reporter did away with the pleasantries, the cops responded accordingly.

Same thing just happened to my brother-in-law 6 months ago. I was leaving his driveway when the cruiser pulled up.

story goes:
He got the expiration notification in the mail then promptly forgot about it. The police arrived at his door, explained why they were there, asked if he had received his notification and why it he hadn't renewed. They asked if gun was on the premises and if so, could they could take the gun for storage until the paperwork was in order? He informed them it was stored at his cottage in the Kawarthas. They explained how to get everything on the up and up, had a brief chat about how they all felt the gun registry was a big waste of money and time for everyone, talked a little about hunting then exchanged handshakes and everyone went amicably on their respective ways.

How is it an agenda to de-arm the civilian population when, with the proper documents, they let you KEEP THE GUN?
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Old 02-03-2010, 08:41 PM   #3
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I agree with you to an extent and then again I want to agree with you totally.
From the "reporters" discription he really made it seem like the officers were being dicks etc.... the time he had to write this well articulated article, could be perceived quite differently if it was actually recorded.

Anyways have your documents and your fine! If you dont have them then **** off and pay the price.
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Old 02-03-2010, 11:10 PM   #4
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So much for the reporter doing his job objectively.
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Old 02-04-2010, 03:36 PM   #5
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stupid story. Reporter is at fault. ignorance of the law is no excuse. And who is Canada does not know you need to have a licence to own a firearm??
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Old 02-04-2010, 04:28 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan27 View Post
This reporter was being difficult - probably had writers block and needed something to write for his column. Don't be a dick to cops, they won't be dicks to you.

I can understand not wanting to open the door for strangers, but uniformed police officers? If he had opened the door or stepped out on the front porch to have a discussion with them it would have gone down much differently. The reporter did away with the pleasantries, the cops responded accordingly.

.

How is it an agenda to de-arm the civilian population when, with the proper documents, they let you KEEP THE GUN?
wow - our memories are short on here, eh? how about those toronto cops going door to door (6000+ homes) to ask if they could come in Search around a bit for an adult missing 60+ days? No? oh well your 'on our list * we may come back with a Search Warrant'

no? no recollection? yes yes im sure its 10,000% the reporters attitude.

- pal the days of 'the neighborhood beat cop thats your friend' is so ****ing over. actually i bet a dr could list a mother ****er as a fetal alchohol case (or just severly ignorant) if you honestly believe or think the cops being at your door is for anything good towards you. even if its to notify you/warn you of say lots of b&e's in ur area (lol never happens), Thats still bad news technically.

"How is it an agenda to de-arm the civilian population when, with the proper documents, they let you KEEP THE GUN?"
because it would be cheaper & more efficient and waaay less ThugLife to send Notifcation via mail, phone msg or email saying re-new your licence, Over two armed guys at your Door bright & early, ****ing Intimating its a Good fkn idea for you to hand it over Pal! then when your like: yawn, go away. they come back with a higher rank to blatantly intimidate you with threats of Tactical units breaching your home with a judge signed possible death -) warrant, cause hey your armed & shit happens. how mindful they were of 'keeping peace' and not escalating things. if its not an 'agenda' its a ****ing anxiety dissorder & they need help

answer me this: when does the law-abiding gun owner - become a dangerous menace to society Criminal that may go around shooting people for whatever reason, and must be treated like one? apparently its 5mins after some ****ing date expires on a piece of paper?
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Old 02-05-2010, 11:47 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmdbley'sBro View Post
wow - our memories are short on here, eh? how about those toronto cops going door to door (6000+ homes) to ask if they could come in Search around a bit for an adult missing 60+ days? No? oh well your 'on our list * we may come back with a Search Warrant'

no? no recollection? yes yes im sure its 10,000% the reporters attitude.
I do recall (and my memory is excellent ), but didn't bring it up as I don't really see the connection between these events. It's not like the cops are randomly knocking on doors asking if you have guns. BTW, how many of those who refused to allow those police to do a search were actually approached with a warrant? any?

The reporter neglected to renew his gun registration - his fault. Even though it's written from the reporters perspective the whole article conveys his rudeness, bad attitude, and overly defensive approach. That is why I posted my brothers experience, to show how it actually happens when you are polite and friendly, the police left, no threats, no supervisors.

Quote:
- pal the days of 'the neighborhood beat cop thats your friend' is so ****ing over. actually i bet a dr could list a mother ****er as a fetal alchohol case (or just severly ignorant) if you honestly believe or think the cops being at your door is for anything good towards you. even if its to notify you/warn you of say lots of b&e's in ur area (lol never happens), Thats still bad news technically.
I realize that I'm not going to be able to have a rapport with every cop I'll come into contact with - that's just the way it is in a large urban area. However, I will always think that police officers searching for lost children or trying to control gun violence is a good thing, even if it puts them on my door step. Their mere presence is not a reason for me to be a jerk - which was the position of the reporter.

Quote:
"How is it an agenda to de-arm the civilian population when, with the proper documents, they let you KEEP THE GUN?"
because it would be cheaper & more efficient and waaay less ThugLife to send Notifcation via mail, phone msg or email saying re-new your licence, Over two armed guys at your Door bright & early, ****ing Intimating its a Good fkn idea for you to hand it over Pal! then when your like: yawn, go away. they come back with a higher rank to blatantly intimidate you with threats of Tactical units breaching your home with a judge signed possible death -) warrant, cause hey your armed & shit happens. how mindful they were of 'keeping peace' and not escalating things. if its not an 'agenda' its a ****ing anxiety dissorder & they need help
as I said, they do send mail. People not opening their mail and saying they never got notice is a daily battle for me. Don't blame the sender if you didn't look at your mail. Don't get defensive, it's your own darn fault. If I get animal control at my door when I forget to renew my dog's licences, I would expect cops to show when my gun licence isn't renewed.

This reporter goes on about how he was offered not options. They may have handed him paperwork if he had OPENED THE DOOR. and I'm sure if they had offered he would have taken the position that the evil popo were trying to trick him into opening it.

Quote:
answer me this: when does the law-abiding gun owner - become a dangerous menace to society Criminal that may go around shooting people for whatever reason, and must be treated like one? apparently its 5mins after some ****ing date expires on a piece of paper?
I suspect this reporter got his renewal notice, then the reminder notice, which came over a period of a few weeks or months - just as my brother's did. So I guess the answer to your questions is: after several weeks after ignoring the law is when he stops being a "law-abiding gun owner". This reporter didn't licence his cat, didn't renew his gun licence. The tags on his car are probably expired and is most likely driving with a suspended licence. He ignores laws left right and centre. What's to say he isn't minutes away from breaking a few more and going on a murderous rampage. (if a search warrant is possibly a death warrant and enforcing a law is an anxiety disorder, then I can draw some ridiculous conclusions of my own)

I do agree with the reporter on one point, I'm glad that self righteous, deer humping prick doesn't have a gun anymore! I do feel safer
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Old 02-05-2010, 12:40 PM   #8
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^^Wow, very well said.
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Old 02-05-2010, 01:27 PM   #9
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2 points.

- you get a notice, you are reminded. you don't renew a weapon expect the cops to be hounding you down.

- if you don't renew your drivers license, you can basically still drive and i'm pretty sure cops won't come to your door and take your car. then again, a gun is made to kill. better safe then sorry. good on the law for doing this.

also, imo, most pistols should be illegal. i don't see a reason why someone should need a pistol.
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Old 02-05-2010, 06:58 PM   #10
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In a free & just society tools should not be illegal. A firearm is just a tool.

Animals have their tools - such as teeth, claws, horns, poisons, speed etc. Humans have none of these things and we are one of the slowest moving animals around. We have brains - with that we make tools. These tools include defensive tools as well as offensive tools.

Handguns are not offensive tools. Fighter jets, Main Battle Tanks, Helicopter Gunships etc. are offensive tools. Front line soldiers are issued rifles for attacks. Handguns are issued to officers for defense.

Some people like using handguns for sport (think Olympic shooting) while others carry them for defense (think cops, security personnel for elected officials, and drug dealers.)

All are equal under the law. When one needs help in seconds - the Police are a phone call + 10 minutes away. Why to Police Officers, elected representatives, and drug dealers have the right to defend themselves - while I do not? Are their lives more important? Criminals will always be able to get guns - just like they get meth, cocaine, E, Special K etc.

Sir Robert Peel is considered to be the father of modern policing. He stated:
Quote:
Police, at all times, should maintain a relationship with the public that gives reality to the historic tradition that the police are the public and the public are the police; the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full-time attention to duties which are incumbent upon every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence.
Therefore we are all police officers and are responsible for the law. Law abiding citizens who have had background checks should be able to use firearms to uphold the law. Firearms are tools and cannot be banned. Try banning them and see what happens. The UK is a great example. Their crime rates went up:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...frica-U-S.html

Britain banned guns in 1997. Their gun crime is off the charts. In US states where trained civilians are allowed to carry concealed handguns - gun crime has fallen.
http://porcupinenine.blogspot.com/20...der-rates.html

That's all I have to say about that.
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Old 02-06-2010, 12:22 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enfield View Post
In a free & just society tools should not be illegal. A firearm is just a tool.

Animals have their tools - such as teeth, claws, horns, poisons, speed etc. Humans have none of these things and we are one of the slowest moving animals around. We have brains - with that we make tools. These tools include defensive tools as well as offensive tools.

Handguns are not offensive tools. Fighter jets, Main Battle Tanks, Helicopter Gunships etc. are offensive tools. Front line soldiers are issued rifles for attacks. Handguns are issued to officers for defense.

Some people like using handguns for sport (think Olympic shooting) while others carry them for defense (think cops, security personnel for elected officials, and drug dealers.)

All are equal under the law. When one needs help in seconds - the Police are a phone call + 10 minutes away. Why to Police Officers, elected representatives, and drug dealers have the right to defend themselves - while I do not? Are their lives more important? Criminals will always be able to get guns - just like they get meth, cocaine, E, Special K etc.

Sir Robert Peel is considered to be the father of modern policing. He stated:


Therefore we are all police officers and are responsible for the law. Law abiding citizens who have had background checks should be able to use firearms to uphold the law. Firearms are tools and cannot be banned. Try banning them and see what happens. The UK is a great example. Their crime rates went up:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...frica-U-S.html

Britain banned guns in 1997. Their gun crime is off the charts. In US states where trained civilians are allowed to carry concealed handguns - gun crime has fallen.
http://porcupinenine.blogspot.com/20...der-rates.html

That's all I have to say about that.

What makes you think a law abiding citizen is responsible to uphold the law?
anyone can legally get a short gun/long gun licence.

What type of training do these law abiding firearm holding citizens have?

I have my PAL for both restricted and non and I have zero training in defensive tactics. SO should I be allowed to go out and save the world just because I am legal?
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Old 02-06-2010, 08:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan27 View Post
.


I realize that I'm not going to be able to have a rapport with every cop I'll come into contact with - that's just the way it is in a large urban area. However, I will always think that police officers searching for lost children or trying to control gun violence is a good thing, even if it puts them on my door step. Their mere presence is not a reason for me to be a jerk - which was the position of the reporter.
hey i never said it was 'a bad thing' too bad thats not what they're doing 9x's out of 10.
traffic enforcement & noise complaints always wondering what they can fine you for (alot of times).

ok cool - on your other points

Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan27 View Post
.
I suspect this reporter got his renewal notice, then the reminder notice, which came over a period of a few weeks or months - just as my brother's did. So I guess the answer to your questions is: after several weeks after ignoring the law is when he stops being a "law-abiding gun owner". This reporter didn't licence his cat, didn't renew his gun licence. The tags on his car are probably expired and is most likely driving with a suspended licence. He ignores laws left right and centre. What's to say he isn't minutes away from breaking a few more and going on a murderous rampage. (if a search warrant is possibly a death warrant and enforcing a law is an anxiety disorder, then I can draw some ridiculous conclusions of my own)

I do agree with the reporter on one point, I'm glad that self righteous, deer humping prick doesn't have a gun anymore! I do feel safer
'whats to say' IDK maybe some laws, values about innocent till proven guilty. long standing court traditions of cops psychic intuitions not being admissable, etc, type thing?
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