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Old 12-10-2009, 06:31 PM   #16
bmwm5lover
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Maluco View Post
Well, more power to you!
Your patience far exceeds mine as you’d rather be stuck at a shop every two weeks so your car doesn't break down (or perhaps it already has) when it's needed the most....during the winter months.
That's where you are wrong, I am the least patient person in the world. It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with "does enjoyment= worth."
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fel View Post
Bingo.

I like that my Civic has been in the shop twice since I've owned it, almost a year... and the bill was never more than $300.

I like that even if something is broken, it'll keep going as if nothing is wrong.

I like that $40 fills the gas tank, and it lasts.
Overlooking repairs because car is running does not mean there is nothing wrong with it(how many things are you overlooking on your civic?). An old european car will outlast a Japanese car anyday if you overlook all the little things. How many 325e' and MB 190's, and Volvo's do u see on the road ticking away with thousands of km's on them with hardly ever a trip to the shop. It's the little things that get the best of Euro cars, but that's b/c they have more to go wrong with them. A basic basic model Volvo (most likely a Euro only model) will continue running way after the civic/corolla has rusted away and is falling apart.

Anyway, lets not take this thread away from what it is about.
I really should have kept my trap shut, but I just have a unbearable hatred for CIvics and Corolla's.
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:03 PM   #18
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I chose the Mazda 3 over Civic when shopping for my wife's car. Nicely modified Civcs are cool but base Vs base I like the Mazda 3 better
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:04 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwm5lover View Post
I really don't understand why people buy Civics, I really don't, and this only further enstills my point, pay SOOO much for insurance for a POS car.
Sorry Terry but your very wrong, I used to put down civics all the tims before I bought one. obviously its not a luxury car, or performance car at any level but, for daily transportation, reliability, fuel efficiency, cheap on maintenance you tell me one car thats better then a civic.

I am talking on a stock to stock level with mature drivers, the honda will reach 250k on average with a fraction of maintenance costs compared to a bmw/audi.

My vert gets 400km to a tank mainly city driving @ roughly 60-70bucks to fill,
Civic gets 400km city only @30 bucks to fill.

And dont think i forgot what you said about almost every trip you would take to the mechanic with your m5 would normally land you a $1000 bill.
I wont even compare my $30 oil change on the civic compared to 85 on the vert.

So please elaborate how the civic is a pos car.

Jay
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:14 PM   #20
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I agree the Mazda 3 Owns the civic now. If i remember correctly i believe they even outsell the civics in Canada now.

PS: why are the escalades so stolen?
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:15 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoony_prelude View Post
Sorry Terry but your very wrong, I used to put down civics all the tims before I bought one. obviously its not a luxury car, or performance car at any level but, for daily transportation, reliability, fuel efficiency, cheap on maintenance you tell me one car thats better then a civic.

I am talking on a stock to stock level with mature drivers, the honda will reach 250k on average with a fraction of maintenance costs compared to a bmw/audi.

My vert gets 400km to a tank mainly city driving @ roughly 60-70bucks to fill,
Civic gets 400km city only @30 bucks to fill.

And dont think i forgot what you said about almost every trip you would take to the mechanic with your m5 would normally land you a $1000 bill.
I wont even compare my $30 oil change on the civic compared to 85 on the vert.

So please elaborate how the civic is a pos car.

Jay
As I said, the discussion is over because we are too far off topic.

There are other reliable A-B cheap to run cars that are 1000% better, IMO, than the Civic or Corollas( Subaru, newer Suzuki's, MAzda (except the new ugly 3) a few Domestics, MB B class even (not sure what the start point is on that)).

Comparing an M5 to a Civic is downright stupid. I have always mentioned basic Euro models vs. the Civic.

Once again, Euro cars are better built, usually safer, and would outlast a Jap counter part, but they have more than can go wrong with them. THe other problem is, that we don't get "true" basic models.

Some food for thought, on a day to day basis, how many 1985 Honda's, Mazda's, Subaru's do you see, and how many 1985 Volvo's, Audi's, MB's, BMW's do you see?? My point.
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Old 12-10-2009, 11:01 PM   #22
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Just keep dumping cash into it. Anything will last.

At my work we have two Toyota 4runner. 2003 and 2007. The 2003 never broke down and it has 160k km now.

I can bet that the money that some owners dumped on their X5s, They would have trouble free 4runner and spare cash to buy E39 M5. Let alone that Toyota will also be worth more when they sell it.
What about 2000 LS 4000. Those easy go for 4-5 k more than your 740I 2000-2001.
People do not want to pay for the name anymore. Than you can not be single forever, be driving a bmw and spending cash on some meterialistic whore. THE wife will come, kids will have to be send to expensive universities for the education and so on.


As soon as 30 comes, that reality kicks is.
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Old 12-10-2009, 11:17 PM   #23
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The SIR is far from a soul-less vehicle. With a couple tasteful mods (I/H/E, suspension, sways, sticky tires) it's a riot to drive, almost on par with the ITR. Not to mention it will run forever if cared for at the level you are implying an European car needs.

The reason they are stolen so much is because of all the desirable parts they have: DOHC, 4 wheel disks, sways, interior, hood/fender/grill, etc.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:56 AM   #24
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Back in the mid to late 80's, european cars were better by far, but as much as i love my euros, in the 90's they fell behind on the reliability!!! Its so bad, at this point my Ford is 110% more reliable then ANY BMW of the same age!

This said, i cant stand how "cheap" most Japanese cars feel...including luxury brands, even E30's have better feel to them! But i guess A to B, that doesnt matter....
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Old 12-11-2009, 03:34 AM   #25
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That was very well said. As much as I would like to agree, I am not sure if the E30 can be driven today as daily? Even the late model ones.... I notice that most E30 guys have bunch of tools , or have turned their garage space into E30 repair facility lol. If not that, their family members owns a shop.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Eurostyle View Post
Back in the mid to late 80's, european cars were better by far, but as much as i love my euros, in the 90's they fell behind on the reliability!!! Its so bad, at this point my Ford is 110% more reliable then ANY BMW of the same age!

This said, i cant stand how "cheap" most Japanese cars feel...including luxury brands, even E30's have better feel to them! But i guess A to B, that doesnt matter....
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Old 12-11-2009, 09:08 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quack View Post
if you were looking for a new reliable vehicle, good fuel economy, and it is in the $20,000 range what would you get, and don't say "I would rather buy used" I'm asking about new here.
i'll join in on this. so if i were forced to buy a brand new car today in the 20K range as a daily driver my first choice would probably be the '10 golf. mazda 3 might be second on the list. i'm not anti-civic but i think i'd get annoyed having to use it as a daily. i like the heavy steering feel of german cars. the civic steering is soooo light and u don't get much response or feel from the road. but to each his own.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:07 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lvan View Post
Just keep dumping cash into it. Anything will last.

At my work we have two Toyota 4runner. 2003 and 2007. The 2003 never broke down and it has 160k km now.

I can bet that the money that some owners dumped on their X5s, They would have trouble free 4runner and spare cash to buy E39 M5. Let alone that Toyota will also be worth more when they sell it.
What about 2000 LS 4000. Those easy go for 4-5 k more than your 740I 2000-2001.
People do not want to pay for the name anymore. Than you can not be single forever, be driving a bmw and spending cash on some meterialistic whore. THE wife will come, kids will have to be send to expensive universities for the education and so on.


As soon as 30 comes, that reality kicks is.
Comparing a 4runner to a X5 is stupid. One is a basic truck with a few power options, and the other is a computer on wheels.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:11 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eurostyle View Post
Back in the mid to late 80's, european cars were better by far, but as much as i love my euros, in the 90's they fell behind on the reliability!!! Its so bad, at this point my Ford is 110% more reliable then ANY BMW of the same age!

This said, i cant stand how "cheap" most Japanese cars feel...including luxury brands, even E30's have better feel to them! But i guess A to B, that doesnt matter....
You are forgetting one thing, most of the BMW's get driven way harder than the ford.
Harder driving= more repairs.

Also, didn't you recently have to replace a whole rear axle?

Your second point is what I am talking about. The feel/response/look/history of the vehicles makes it worth while to spend $$$ to keep them going and fixing the little things.
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:13 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lvan View Post
That was very well said. As much as I would like to agree, I am not sure if the E30 can be driven today as daily? Even the late model ones.... I notice that most E30 guys have bunch of tools , or have turned their garage space into E30 repair facility lol. If not that, their family members owns a shop.
That's because you are on an enthusiast site where owners drive their cars, hard, upgrade their cars, and like the thought of having spares.

Go talk to someone who uses an e30 as an A to B and see what they tell you, oil changes and maintenance and they keep trucking.

I literally drove the piss out of my e30 and NEVER had a problem (aside from a fuel pump, water pump, and a rear diff seal.)
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Old 12-11-2009, 12:26 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by bmwm5lover View Post
You are forgetting one thing, most of the BMW's get driven way harder than the ford.
Harder driving= more repairs.

Also, didn't you recently have to replace a whole rear axle?

Your second point is what I am talking about. The feel/response/look/history of the vehicles makes it worth while to spend $$$ to keep them going and fixing the little things.
No, i was actually taking about all the small things that go wrong on most BMW, that have nothing to do with driving, or proper maintenance! Like the rear window regulators, broken rear springs,cluster LED's, heating controls, AC leaks, heater valves and the list goes on and on!!! All those are small problems, that are anoying, and end up costing some good $$$ if you have to get it fixed all the time.

As to the Ford needing a rear end, that is hardly surprising at 400K, and being used mainly for towing 2.5 tons on daily basis! Other then that, not a single problem for the 30K i owned it!
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