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Old 02-28-2003, 06:20 PM   #76
IVAN
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wow merda merda merda

wHY dont you just move to Italia ???
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Old 02-28-2003, 06:27 PM   #77
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Couldn't you get a job down there if someone sponsors you? I guess it all goes back to having a job first before venturing out.

Secondly, golf is great in Arizona. Watch out for rattlers!

Enjoy the sun.
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Old 02-28-2003, 10:58 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally posted by GR8 Ride
First of all, a TN Visa can be used for a max of 3 years, after which you have to leave the country, and can't re-apply for a period of 3 years.

The TN Visa was never designed to allow someone to move to the US. It DOES allow someone to work in the US, but it was designed for travelling from Canada/Mexico into the US for work, not for permanent relocation. The TN Visa must be renewed annually, and the INS isn't likely to renew it beyond a 2 or 3 year period (that's what the L1 and H1 Visas are for).



You make your point right above....what did your parents teach you when they raised you? Guess what? If you get caught cheating the system, you can forget about getting into the US (even on vacation) for the next 5-7 years, and possibly longer, given the situation now. Not only that, what about the basic moral issue of living a lie, knowing that the INS *could* come knocking on your door any day, due to your name popping up on a computer.

VISA inspections are much different than they were 2 or 3 years ago. That Sept 11 incident tended to lock the border a little tighter than it has been (except for Canada's, which is still a sieve), and the rapid decline of the tech sector caused the demand for H1 Visa's to drop. Those two factors alone contribute highly to the fact that it's much harder to get a job in the US than it was previously.

A LOT of companies now won't even look at hiring Canadians, because they'd never pass the DOL Certification requirements. Getting an H1 Visa requires DOL Certification, which means the employer has to advertise the position for a number of weeks, and ONLY after being unable to recruit a suitable US Citizen, can offer the job to a Canadian.

Yes, the TN Visa has a fairly large umbrella, but no hope in hell is going to make Used Car Salesman one of them.

Like any system, there are ways around it. But in getting around the system, you're not *really* able to relax, as sooner or later they'll end up finding you. I know several people who *massaged the system* to get in and work in the US, and are now back in Canada because the system finally caught up to them.


Pat [/b]
How long did that take you to type up?

Response in point form
- I never implied the TN is a permanent visa. Its just a quick convenient way to quickly and easily get into the States short term
- I already said that used car salesmen do not fall under the umbrella thats obvious, many hotel service jobs do fall in this category, maybe the point form will make it easier for you to read this
- my parents raised me very well, if you want to pursue this line of conversation we should talk face to face
- Visa inspections haven't changed at all since 9/11 if you were born in Canada, exact same process - I've gone through it twice since. If you weren't born in Canada then its a pain, involving required checkins with your local FBI office monthly if you happen to have been born in a middle eastern country like Iran.
- its not that difficult to get the DOL certification (proof of advertising, candidate resumes), Canada has a very similar requirement which we've gone through recently PM me for details if you wish
- what did your acquaintances do to get 5-7? I've heard of one person from university getting banned for 2 years but he was and is an idiot
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Old 02-28-2003, 11:11 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally posted by GR8 Ride
Geez Rob, what hare-brained scheme have you managed to come up with now?

Guess what buddy, better hope your parents don't renovate your room the minute you move out, because 2 hours after you leave, you'll be back home again.

First of all, a TN Visa is a temporary work Visa for trips to the US. It does NOT allow a person to move to the US. Secondly, you must have a job offer FIRST before they can grant you a Visa, and three, used car salesman doesn't appear on the list.

How do you suppose you're going to get across the border with all your stuff in the trunk of your M3? "Yes Mr Border Guard, I'm taking my TV and VCR with me on a vacation to Arizona..."

Guess what? Without a Visa allowing you to MOVE to the US (such as an H1, L1-A, L1-B et al), they won't let you cross the border. And once you're tagged at the border, they'll be checking you over everytime you attempt to cross.

Without a valid US Visa, you can't get a Social Security number, which means nobody can legally pay you. Sure, you could wash dishes for cash in the local restaurant, but I doubt your new girlfriend would love to spend the rest of her life with an INS fugitive who washes dishes in a nearby greasy spoon.

Secondly, how would you plan on getting an Arizona driver's license, or tags for your car? You don't think the local authorities will notice those Ontario plates and license when they pull you over?

As much as it would create some peace around here to have you in Arizona, this lame-brained scheme of yours is never going to work.

Of course, you could always sneak in illegally....that would be fun to watch. I wonder how many times I'd have to call the INS before they'd finally get you?

If you're desperate, you could always knock up your little Arizona sweetheart, marry her, and then sell your M3 to pay the bills. You'd at least have a chance of getting a green card on marital status anyway....


On the flipside, it's really too bad that the border is largely closed to Canadians without a job offer (and tough even then). It's apparently easier to get into the US by being from a third world country, than it is from Canada.... The hoops I had to jump through to live and work in the US was a major PITA.


Pat
for one asshat.. The job part is covered.. I live here and i offered to help him find a job before he left Canada.. Didn't know that did ya? And i have some aquintences..

2. i'm sure he could apply for dual citizenship, there are a lot of people in the states from canada with that.. It's not like he's coming from iraq and trying to get citizenship..

3. there are a ton of illegal aliens here already..

4. doesn't matter about the ontario plates.. there are so many snow birds here with plates from way far north that it doesn't really matter.. That, and there aren't as many cops here as there are in other places.. Last i heard there are about 4.5 million people in the Phoenix area.. It's quite a big place.. So, they are limited on the fuzz...

i can't think of anything else you said that i could argue with at the moment and i'm too lazy to look it up.. so i'm done..
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Old 02-28-2003, 11:19 PM   #80
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I didn't mean for this thread to get this long.....


Okay, I'm not moving anymore. Sorry for getting everyone anxious, including you Emily.

The timing is bad now with all this war crap going on.

I do respect all the help and insight (especially Pat & Nick P)
THANKS
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Old 02-28-2003, 11:27 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally posted by e30 318i
for one asshat.. The job part is covered.. I live here and i offered to help him find a job before he left Canada.. Didn't know that did ya? And i have some aquintences..

2. i'm sure he could apply for dual citizenship, there are a lot of people in the states from canada with that.. It's not like he's coming from iraq and trying to get citizenship..

3. there are a ton of illegal aliens here already..

4. doesn't matter about the ontario plates.. there are so many snow birds here with plates from way far north that it doesn't really matter.. That, and there aren't as many cops here as there are in other places.. Last i heard there are about 4.5 million people in the Phoenix area.. It's quite a big place.. So, they are limited on the fuzz...

i can't think of anything else you said that i could argue with at the moment and i'm too lazy to look it up.. so i'm done..
Boy, you don't know much about US immigration laws, do you?

How do you suppose Rob is going to apply for dual citizenship? Unless his parents are current US citizens, or he was born in the US while his parents were travelling there does he have the right to apply for US citizenship. Otherwise, a work Visa is required.

I guess if you're dumb enough to fall for Rob, you're dumb enough to not know anything about how your own country's immigration laws work....

So what type of job could you get Rob? Just because he gets a job offer from someone doesn't mean that it falls under a legitimate category for a work Visa.

As to the comment about lots of illegal aliens being there already, what does that have to do with Rob getting into the country? It's a LOT easier to sneak into the country if you're not planning on working for real money, or bringing your own possessions / car across the border. Like I said, it would be funny to see Rob trying to get his M3 loaded with all his possession across the border....

Maybe you should learn just who you're talking to before you call them "asshat".

Oh well, I guess there's just one more dumb **** who believes all the stuff that Rob spouts....


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Old 02-28-2003, 11:31 PM   #82
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Pat Buthman,
you like to start *stuff* eh ?

Well well, this thread was started BY ME, soooooo.........
I suggest you stop taking *shots* at me and bring your frustrations to teh racetrack..... haha

Anyways, thanks for your knowledge though.
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Old 02-28-2003, 11:43 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally posted by NickP
How long did that take you to type up?

Response in point form
- I never implied the TN is a permanent visa. Its just a quick convenient way to quickly and easily get into the States short term
- I already said that used car salesmen do not fall under the umbrella thats obvious, many hotel service jobs do fall in this category, maybe the point form will make it easier for you to read this
- my parents raised me very well, if you want to pursue this line of conversation we should talk face to face
- Visa inspections haven't changed at all since 9/11 if you were born in Canada, exact same process - I've gone through it twice since. If you weren't born in Canada then its a pain, involving required checkins with your local FBI office monthly if you happen to have been born in a middle eastern country like Iran.
- its not that difficult to get the DOL certification (proof of advertising, candidate resumes), Canada has a very similar requirement which we've gone through recently PM me for details if you wish
- what did your acquaintances do to get 5-7? I've heard of one person from university getting banned for 2 years but he was and is an idiot
Anytime you want a face to face meeting, bring it on. My point simply being, my parents raised me to not bullshit my way through life, regardless of whether I'd be able to profit from it or not. You've got to stand for something, and one thing I'll always have are my principles.

As I've said before, WHAT VISA WILL ROB GET INTO THE US ON TO LEGALLY WORK?

Guess what? None.

He has ZERO qualifications as a Hotel Manager, which is the only service job listed on the State Dept website for qualification under the TN Visa section. Funny, I also don't see ANY categories on the State Dept website which don't have a requirement for post secondary education. All things considered, this is a relatively big hurdle to overcome.

Let's not forget, some sucker has to offer Rob a JOB to even begin the Visa process, and one at least vaguely under the list in question. Any good immigration lawyer will advise him that it's tough for him to do....

Visa inspections for TN visas may not have changed, since those are handled in real time at the border, and it's a case of having the documentation with you to prove your claim.

H1 Visas have gone under much stronger scrutiny, to the point where many companies are no longer interested in taking on the hassle to get them through. Remember, the biggest part of getting a decent Visa arranged for work in the US are the legal fees (upwards of $15,000 US, depending upon the Visa being applied for).

As I said before, like any system, things can be worked around to make the system easier to handle. Getting a Visa of ANY flavour is much easier if you have a degree and many years of experience to back it up; this helps the DOL certification issues for permanent Visas. DOL isn't an issue for a TN Visa, but it needs to be renewed annually, either in person or via the mail. It's a simple process there.

If he was going down there in a high tech industry of some sort, he'd have a fairly good chance at getting a TN Visa. But trade level or unskilled worker jobs are pretty tough to swing a Visa for.


As to 5-7, it's the max penalty for INS violations (short of a lifetime ban). I know two guys working in the US (with no Visa) who were booted out, and given a 5 year ban on entering the US. Something *beyond* INS violations may have occured, triggering the full penalty....they were reluctant to tell me much.

How current those penalties are, I'm not sure.

My point being simply this: You can't say it's easy to get a Visa to live and work in the US. Sure, with a 4 year degree, and lots of work experience in a high demand field, it's not difficult at all (been there, done that).

But for blue collar and unskilled labour, getting a job in the US is fairly tough, especially with US unemployment as high as it is.

All of this is presuming you can find an employer in the US who is willing to hire a foreigner to begin with.


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Last edited by GR8 Ride; 02-28-2003 at 11:46 PM.
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Old 02-28-2003, 11:45 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally posted by ROB89M3
Pat Buthman,
you like to start *stuff* eh ?

Well well, this thread was started BY ME, soooooo.........
I suggest you stop taking *shots* at me and bring your frustrations to teh racetrack..... haha

Anyways, thanks for your knowledge though.
Start stuff? What did I start? I pointed out some facts that packing up and moving to the US is not simply as easy as going ahead and driving down there....facts which NOBODY has been able to dispute on here.

Your little lapdog is the one who is starting shit....better keep her on a leash Rob.


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Old 02-28-2003, 11:47 PM   #85
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You're not moving!?
Great going now he will have to freeze to death!
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Old 03-01-2003, 12:27 AM   #86
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getting duel-citizenship is like having a threesome they are so hard to come by.... pat is right you are required to have been born or a parental figure being a US citizen to apply for duel... before anyone questions me on this. let it be know that i am both american (born in US, and father is american) and Canadian (mother is a canadain and i have legally stayed my certain amount of years here to actually pick up my legit citizenship card)... if you are to work in the states legitimately, you will need a work visa.... plain and simple. i know lots of people who have had or are having trouble getting a work visa, they arent that hard to obtain. all i can say to you Rob is make sure you have tied up any loose or possible loose ends before you quit your job, pack your sh1t, sell stuff for extra cash, etc etc etc,,, only to find nothing but a dissapointing short vacation to arizona..

Last edited by Furious; 03-01-2003 at 12:31 AM.
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Old 03-01-2003, 11:06 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally posted by GR8 Ride
Start stuff? What did I start? I pointed out some facts that packing up and moving to the US is not simply as easy as going ahead and driving down there....facts which NOBODY has been able to dispute on here.

Your little lapdog is the one who is starting shit....better keep her on a leash Rob.


Pat
I might be offended by being called a lapdog if it wasn't from a dismissive annoying little prick, and Pat you can PM if you want to continue this offline.

I'd reply to you other post but I'd rather read War and Peace, there's probably nothing new there anyways.
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Old 03-01-2003, 12:43 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally posted by NickP
I might be offended by being called a lapdog if it wasn't from a dismissive annoying little prick, and Pat you can PM if you want to continue this offline.

I'd reply to you other post but I'd rather read War and Peace, there's probably nothing new there anyways.
You might want to read again Nick, as the lapdog comment wasn't aimed at you.

Don't be so quick to jump on something until you've read everything entirely....

My debate is with you....SHE, on the other hand, has nothing valid to offer.

And there is STILL no Visa which will get Rob into the US to work legally, unless some miracle happens and he pulls a degree out of his hat.


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