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Old 01-25-2009, 05:18 PM   #31
328trackrat
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It's really a case of Searcher's and Planners if anyone has read into Easterly or Sachs economics on aid.. I took a class that touched a bit on there work related to aid given Africa however I believe it applies locally here as well.

The planners are what I would call the people in upper government who have great plans to reduce poverty and to get all these poor people out of the poverty trap. There plans involve lots of money being put into these communities through handouts and subsidies etc. However simply throwing more and more money at them is not a solution. Plans like these have been proven time and time again not to work (look at Africa, in the last 50yrs the over 50+billion dollars given in foreign aid HAS NOT made significant improvements to 90% of those in the poverty trap). There needs to be incentive for people to take the initiative and move out of the poverty trap on their own. Simply giving people handouts (welfare $) or subsidized housing does not give them any incentive to better themselves. They must figure out a way to help these people but through programs that will reward them for making improvements.

Essentially searchers are those at the bottom of the chain who are working with the people, and they know what will work best for them. They try small scale programs to see how well they work and then tweak them for best results. They are constantly figuring new approaches that can work for the people so they can move out of these poverty traps.

I am not arguing against welfare etc, however just stating that there are much better solutions that would be more effective in moving more of the population out of the poverty trap then simply giving handouts etc.
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Old 01-25-2009, 05:22 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystikal View Post
But it's not disproportionate to income.

Cross crime data over of poor white people with poor black people. It's basically identical. One race just happens to have a higher propensity to have less money.
exactly.


The correlation between race and violence/prison sentences/drug crimes
(AKA to put bluntly, the propensity for black people to commit violent/drug offenses) and to be sent to jail is not relevant.

COUNTLESS studies have shown that the correlation between POVERTY and drug/violent offenses is much higher, and the figures for race are sweked because most blacks/hispanics (particularly in urban areas of the USA) are more likely to be poor than not.
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Old 01-25-2009, 08:56 PM   #33
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Old 01-25-2009, 11:27 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by propr'one View Post
exactly.


The correlation between race and violence/prison sentences/drug crimes
(AKA to put bluntly, the propensity for black people to commit violent/drug offenses) and to be sent to jail is not relevant.

COUNTLESS studies have shown that the correlation between POVERTY and drug/violent offenses is much higher, and the figures for race are sweked because most blacks/hispanics (particularly in urban areas of the USA) are more likely to be poor than not.
another bias study ... do you know how many immigrants come to canada with a suitcase and about $100 to there name and still do well. They come here poor but they end up middle class or better. Polish, Portuguese, Indian, Italian, etc

so this Poverty to drug/violence relation is bullshit .. sorry.
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Old 01-25-2009, 11:45 PM   #35
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another bias study ... do you know how many immigrants come to canada with a suitcase and about $100 to there name and still do well. They come here poor but they end up middle class or better. Polish, Portuguese, Indian, Italian, etc

so this Poverty to drug/violence relation is bullshit .. sorry.
Yup, my parents came over here in 1981 with $10 USD, not a word of English, and made it. I think most people are looking for an excuse for laziness.
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Old 01-25-2009, 11:56 PM   #36
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Yup, my parents came over here in 1981 with $10 USD, not a word of English, and made it. I think most people are looking for an excuse for laziness.
mine too .. dad has nothing but an aunt here .. he started off working at a farm .. then doing roof shingles on houses for someone .. then welding, etc ,etc

not a gun in his hand ..
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:42 AM   #37
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I really don't get this cartoon. Can't believe its on TV.
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Old 01-26-2009, 09:12 AM   #38
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Yup, my parents came over here in 1981 with $10 USD, not a word of English, and made it. I think most people are looking for an excuse for laziness.
Bingo.

Some individuals are driven to overcome their situations and succeed in life. Other individuals use their situation as an excuse for their lack of success. Life is what you make of it.
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Old 01-26-2009, 10:11 AM   #39
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noone is ever going to stop crime.. not now not ever.. crime and murder drug offences. will always exist, its what creates jobs makes the world go round. (i.e correctional officers)
any one over the age of 19 can own a firearm. within a week if i presume correctly.
and im sure someone with no street connections can purchase a firearm with in a month.
doesnt matter on how hard you crack down on them. take one off the streets 2 slip through the border.

It would be nice if we had the street crimes of Nova Scotia

no wait ... georgetown

hold on ill get this right .. PEI .. manitoulinand island ..

damn .. I couldnt prove your point because there are no street crimes were there are no gangs.


but i will agree there is some truth to what your saying. It would be nice if there was reduced crimes
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Old 01-26-2009, 10:25 AM   #40
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It would be nice if we had the street crimes of Nova Scotia

no wait ... georgetown

hold on ill get this right .. PEI .. manitoulinand island ..

damn .. I couldnt prove your point because there are no street crimes were there are no gangs.


but i will agree there is some truth to what your saying. It would be nice if there was reduced crimes
lol...

Man, I know that if I went for a drive through Newfoundland, I'd make sure my doors were always locked!!! Never know when outta nowhere... blap blap! Car jacked. Those crazy fisherman will do anything for a buck.
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Old 01-26-2009, 10:57 AM   #41
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I think there is more vehicle thefts in Winnepeg then there is in Toronto.
*Winterpeg
it is the WORST city in Canada for car thefts, by far
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Old 01-26-2009, 11:57 AM   #42
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So I can be sure to avoid a similar looking suspect on the street, and call the cops if I see any potential suspects. Its my right as a citizen of Canada. Do you want to challenge my rights and freedoms now genious?
Haha bullshit.

You know you weren't going to get anything more detailed than "black" "white" or "asian". If you were planning to avoid all teenagers from any one of those groups and/or call the cops about them, you'd be a busy man.

You're so transparent, it kills me.
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:00 PM   #43
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another bias study ... do you know how many immigrants come to canada with a suitcase and about $100 to there name and still do well. They come here poor but they end up middle class or better. Polish, Portuguese, Indian, Italian, etc

so this Poverty to drug/violence relation is bullshit .. sorry.
It's proven that immigrants in any financial class have lower crime rates than people born in the country within the same class.

But that doesn't mean that there isn't a direct correlation between poverty and crime. There is, and it would be even more marked if the immigrants were more like their native counterparts.
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:22 PM   #44
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It's proven that immigrants in any financial class have lower crime rates than people born in the country within the same class.

But that doesn't mean that there isn't a direct correlation between poverty and crime. There is, and it would be even more marked if the immigrants were more like their native counterparts.
I find that very surprising. Got a link? Not doubting you, I just want to see this info for myself - seems to be counter-intuitive lol.
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:29 PM   #45
Blades
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Originally Posted by Mystikal View Post
It's proven that immigrants in any financial class have lower crime rates than people born in the country within the same class.

But that doesn't mean that there isn't a direct correlation between poverty and crime. There is, and it would be even more marked if the immigrants were more like their native counterparts.
hmm but then your theory wouldnt work on Newfoundland or Nova Scotia .. must be something else.

I think the best way to get an answer would be to do statistics within a prison yet the results would still be biased based on people that were caught oppose to those that didnt. Yet im sure you would fine your end results and get your who, what, and why.
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