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View Full Version : "Street racing laws Should have been made stricter!" -- Fantino Le douchebag!


Bmwstylz
10-29-2007, 02:55 PM
The latest today is that now he regrets not making the Street racing laws stricter - because they caught so many people in the last month.

No shit! because speeding is the norm!!! ... and 160km/h is perfectly safe in the right conditions.

Comish Fantino says 30km/h should have been the threshold...

I hope this law gets demolished soon.*uzi*

5JABIJ8
10-29-2007, 03:10 PM
Ah man that would suck if they changed to 30Kms. I drive 130 all the time man.. now fantino wants to lower the speed from 50 to 30 WTF!!!!!

Boots R
10-29-2007, 03:18 PM
Glad to see this is the main concern of police departments everywhere.

*thmbsdwn*

hadesm5
10-29-2007, 03:39 PM
... and 160km/h is perfectly safe in the right conditions.


no its not. and these "right conditions" are too idealistic

Boots R
10-29-2007, 03:53 PM
no its not. and these "right conditions" are too idealistic

If you are going over 5km/h it's unsafe in some capacity.

BMW03
10-29-2007, 03:56 PM
Glad to see this is the main concern of police departments everywhere.

*thmbsdwn*


Thats the real point, they are focusing on this so much, when it should just be brought to another area where people are getting shot or whatever else is going on out there. Not some kids or people just havin a little fun in "street racing"

AMG_POWER
10-29-2007, 04:35 PM
Thats the real point, they are focusing on this so much, when it should just be brought to another area where people are getting shot or whatever else is going on out there. Not some kids or people just havin a little fun in "street racing"


Its all about money.

abc12
10-29-2007, 04:54 PM
that's pretty ridiculous...

let's try to bring cops to justice when they start doing dangerous things.. like speeding around for no apparent reasons with no sires on or whatever... but it's a lose lose situation in the city of toronto... one big cash grab for them... trying to milk everyone that lives here for everything they've got... like bogus tickets, increase taxes, towing people cars and charging a ridiculous amount just to get ur car back even when the impound is a few blocks away from where u parked.....

let's see what happens as the days go by..

Arash
10-29-2007, 05:08 PM
The judges are just gonna shit all over the politicians, just wait till the cases hit the courts!!

dtthiaga
10-29-2007, 06:49 PM
This is why you should fight every ticket, to backlog the courts and start getting cases thrown out for taking too long.

BimmerboyPH
10-29-2007, 08:06 PM
O yay lets waste even more time with this BS law, all the while we have gangs killing eachother and the public. There are so many issues which need dealing with which are causeing a thousand times more hurt and damage.

I cant wait till people start dieing because the police start chasing them! ( Now im not saying i want people to die, but you get what im saying)

AceOfSpades
10-29-2007, 08:28 PM
Its all about money.

niiiice sig*th-up* *th-up*

and yes, **** fantino

Old_School
10-29-2007, 08:54 PM
no its not. and these "right conditions" are too idealistic

I've hit the limiter on an '03 325i - 220 km/h. All perfectly safe and legal in Germany. But I guess they're too idealistic.


Maybe a 30km/h threshold would be realistic if the set speed limit was realistic.

M3ti Compact
10-29-2007, 09:09 PM
To anyone who says speed is dangerous, I really invite them to go drive in Germany.

I used to say difference in speed is dangerous- but this is really not so either.

The real problem is, and if you really want to see less accidents, you got to get rid of the shitty drivers. The reasons why Germans can handle the speed is that they take driving ultra seriously and with respect. Something us north americans still have trouble grasping the concept of.

Right now, the law is unconstitutional, and is a pure and simple cash grab and power trip enabling bs law for sole benefit of the police. Who has honestly seen a difference in driving habits on our roads since the law was put in?

skru_fase
10-29-2007, 09:23 PM
To anyone who says speed is dangerous, I really invite them to go drive in Germany.

I used to say difference in speed is dangerous- but this is really not so either.

The real problem is, and if you really want to see less accidents, you got to get rid of the shitty drivers. The reasons why Germans can handle the speed is that they take driving ultra seriously and with respect. Something us north americans still have trouble grasping the concept of.



i haven't driven in europe, but isn't it almost true that most european countries are far better drivers than north americans? specifically, i have heard the french are very conscientious drivers..

...and i can't see a 30 over = street racing law ever coming into effect, that would be a nightmare to try and enforce

europrince
10-29-2007, 09:25 PM
^ everyone forgets that our highways were designed to drive at that speed and that the speed limit was dropped in the 70s during the oil crisis

El Gato Liso
10-29-2007, 09:37 PM
i haven't driven in europe, but isn't it almost true that most european countries are far better drivers than north americans? specifically, i have heard the french are very conscientious drivers..

...and i can't see a 30 over = street racing law ever coming into effect, that would be a nightmare to try and enforce

actually

jamaican drivers are the best in my opinion. if you can handle and drive the jam rock streets you can drive and handle any other streets int he world.

alexm520
10-29-2007, 09:51 PM
Its all about money.

Agreed. Plus a public image that police is doing "something" and making a difference. It is an easy way to divert attention from the real issues likes gun shootings and other violent crimes.

.

abc12
10-29-2007, 10:24 PM
actually

jamaican drivers are the best in my opinion. if you can handle and drive the jam rock streets you can drive and handle any other streets int he world.

i take it you've been to jamaica as well, cause i have and it is totally insane how people drive down them.... like i can't even believe and see with my own eyes how people drive there...

europrince
10-29-2007, 11:32 PM
^ southern europe is just as bad

vadim321go
10-29-2007, 11:34 PM
these laws are idiotic. when you have several tons of metal moving at a speed of over 20km.h an hour its already unsafe. you think if ur driving at 60, you cant kill someone? what are we not going to be able to drive soon either?

hadesm5
10-29-2007, 11:58 PM
we're not in germany, thats one external factor. the 401 is not the autobahn, thats another external factor. overcrowded highways, shitty weather, poorly maintened roads. those are all factors.
theres a certain point where the traction is just not enough and u think u have control but u dont. besides not all ppl are perfect drivers that can handle high speeds.

i'm just sick of teenage (or even older) punks thinking they are hotshot racers, disturbing the public with their annoying driving and making driving an unenjoyable experience for enthusiasts due to cops assuming all sports cars are driven by these kinds of drivers.

ofcourse you can have a fatal accident at lower speeds, but I am referring to stunt driving attitude more than just speed.

i like the law becuase i feel that it could reduce stunt driving because of the fear of getting caught. but i cant argue if it is very effective because it is too early to decide.

Axxe
10-30-2007, 09:17 AM
we're not in germany, thats one external factor. the 401 is not the autobahn, thats another external factor. overcrowded highways, shitty weather, poorly maintened roads. those are all factors.
theres a certain point where the traction is just not enough and u think u have control but u dont. besides not all ppl are perfect drivers that can handle high speeds.

i'm just sick of teenage (or even older) punks thinking they are hotshot racers, disturbing the public with their annoying driving and making driving an unenjoyable experience for enthusiasts due to cops assuming all sports cars are driven by these kinds of drivers.

ofcourse you can have a fatal accident at lower speeds, but I am referring to stunt driving attitude more than just speed.

i like the law becuase i feel that it could reduce stunt driving because of the fear of getting caught. but i cant argue if it is very effective because it is too early to decide.

What's next, you'll approve them chopping off your manhood just to ensure you don't rape anyone? I mean, all men SHOULD be charged with rape, we're equipped to do the deed!

bmdbley'sBro
10-30-2007, 10:44 AM
-
again guys its not just the Speed they can Rape you on

-unsafe/aggressive lane changes
-tailgating
-driving too fast for conditions??
- cop don't like your stupid face..

also if you get a second conviction within 10years of the 1st
they can impose a 10year driving ban




thank you Gihadist law makers for your Fatwa on Driving *thmbsdwn*

punnzzells
10-30-2007, 11:30 AM
we're not in germany, thats one external factor. the 401 is not the autobahn, thats another external factor. overcrowded highways, shitty weather, poorly maintened roads. those are all factors.
theres a certain point where the traction is just not enough and u think u have control but u dont. besides not all ppl are perfect drivers that can handle high speeds.

i'm just sick of teenage (or even older) punks thinking they are hotshot racers, disturbing the public with their annoying driving and making driving an unenjoyable experience for enthusiasts due to cops assuming all sports cars are driven by these kinds of drivers.

ofcourse you can have a fatal accident at lower speeds, but I am referring to stunt driving attitude more than just speed.

i like the law becuase i feel that it could reduce stunt driving because of the fear of getting caught. but i cant argue if it is very effective because it is too early to decide.

you have some good points... a lot of younger , inexperienced, I just watched a movie rice burners do drive like that... but this law ain't gonna do SHIOT!

there are still late night runs... there are still people doing burn outs.. there are still people driving in / out of traffic... it hasn't changed a thing... so, I can drive like a looser at 140km/h and I am OK... but if I go 11 Km/h more over then you are a danger.... paaaleeze! how does that make sense.. the problems for Ontario drivers, especially GTA residents are;


1 - Poorly educated drivers
2 - People doing 15 things in their cars, except driving
3 - people who are scared to drive
4 - unsafe cars on the road
5 - hot shots

how can we fix this...

make it VERY hard to get a license and expensive.... it's VERY expensive in Germany....I heard it was over 1000 euro to get it... put in a 3 strike rule... if you are 100% at fault causing 3 accidents in 3 years, then your license is gone for 5 years... start to crack down on cars that are rust buckets and unsafe cars too... MTO does it for trucks, why not cars? if you get some of the bad drivers off the road, then maybe you won't have as many hot shots trying to get through traffic...

the gov't is a business... ( here goes my unibomber mind set ) and they do not give two shiots about any of us... they won't hire more people to patrol and educate.. they will squeeze what they can out from what they have.... putting no money into our safety... but increasing their wages by 25% with the $$$.. waaaay above a COLA inscrease that I get, by the way. But... I can't blame them... no one in this province gives a shiot... it's that sheep mentality....so I say..

PUT UP A FIGHT OR SHUT THE FALK UP!

if someone is really going to get organized.. do it... if not, then what's the point of even arguing and whinning? oh ya.. I know why... b/c that's all the TREE HUGGING CALK SWALLOGISTS DO IN THIS COUNTRY... tip toe tip toe around the issues!

*thmbsdwn*

jstalin
10-30-2007, 11:42 AM
The real problem is, and if you really want to see less accidents, you got to get rid of the shitty drivers. The reasons why Germans can handle the speed is that they take driving ultra seriously and with respect. Something us north americans still have trouble grasping the concept of.



You conveniently forget to mention that in Germany, it is mandatory to complete ~6 months of driving instruction before doing your test. Then it costs another 2000 Euros to get your license. It's not that the German race are inherintly better drivers, mandatory training & high cost of entry weed out lots of idiots.

It's also worth noting that in Germany, you're only punished once for speeding, once you pay your ticket the damage is done. Here, not only have you got to pay the ticket, but your insurance rates can go way up as a result, which is completely illogical & unfair. Insurance companies seem to have created our road laws

Anomili
10-30-2007, 01:57 PM
Money money money... just make enough to do whatever you want. That is my policy.


PS. Anyone know how to make money? lol

jstalin
10-30-2007, 01:59 PM
PS. Anyone know how to make money? lol

A scanner & a good quality laser printer

Boots R
10-30-2007, 02:03 PM
PS. Anyone know how to make money? lol

Plant a loonie and make a loonie tree.

europrince
10-30-2007, 02:09 PM
Anyone know how to make money? lol

get a job ;)

Anomili
10-30-2007, 02:31 PM
lol, it was a joke.

ZHP_Bimmer05
10-30-2007, 02:42 PM
We must follow the rules, and crooked ass cops can do whatever they want, I always see cops blow past me with no sirens off. Hipacrits!

punnzzells
10-30-2007, 05:19 PM
We must follow the rules, and crooked ass cops can do whatever they want, I always see cops blow past me with no sirens off. Hipacrits!

ya... I asked a cop that once who pulled me over... he didn't like it too much... long story...!

Arash
10-30-2007, 05:48 PM
Plant a loonie and make a loonie tree.

I have a better idea! *smoke*

Chris de la Cruz
10-30-2007, 08:11 PM
while the cops are busy fighting speeding.. i'm going to go about and continue my drug cartel. Hopefully none of my runners aren't speeding.

Mystikal
10-30-2007, 08:22 PM
actually

jamaican drivers are the best in my opinion. if you can handle and drive the jam rock streets you can drive and handle any other streets int he world.

Haha, whenever we go down I'm attacking the mountains in a Sienna. It's literally bigger than the mini-busses, and can outrun 95% of the other cars. Nothing is funnier than ruining some dude in a modded sport compact on a mountain road (with no guardrail) in a massive minivan with 7 people inside.

Jay

bmwm5lover
10-30-2007, 08:24 PM
I will agree with the comment about Jamaican drivers. When I was there, many a time I almost shit myself. those guys are nuts, and push the HELL of w/e it is they drive. Those little Diesel Toyota MiniBuses are driven like sports cars.

I had a great time though.

BimmerboyPH
10-30-2007, 08:38 PM
we're not in germany, thats one external factor. the 401 is not the autobahn, thats another external factor. overcrowded highways, shitty weather, poorly maintened roads. those are all factors.
theres a certain point where the traction is just not enough and u think u have control but u dont. besides not all ppl are perfect drivers that can handle high speeds.

i'm just sick of teenage (or even older) punks thinking they are hotshot racers, disturbing the public with their annoying driving and making driving an unenjoyable experience for enthusiasts due to cops assuming all sports cars are driven by these kinds of drivers.

ofcourse you can have a fatal accident at lower speeds, but I am referring to stunt driving attitude more than just speed.

i like the law becuase i feel that it could reduce stunt driving because of the fear of getting caught. but i cant argue if it is very effective because it is too early to decide.



But why do you think most of us have BMW's?? There called the ultimate driving machine for a reason, and they need to be driven in a certain way! Otherwise whats the point. We have worked hard to afford these cars, now shouldn't we be allowed access to the rewards? Now i dont mean lets all go bombing along doing 200k, flying in and out of traffic. But i dont see the problem with me going out into the country and having a spirited drive. But i wont now because im affraid i may do something stupid if a cop catches me.

BimmerboyPH
10-30-2007, 08:39 PM
you have some good points... a lot of younger , inexperienced, I just watched a movie rice burners do drive like that... but this law ain't gonna do SHIOT!

there are still late night runs... there are still people doing burn outs.. there are still people driving in / out of traffic... it hasn't changed a thing... so, I can drive like a looser at 140km/h and I am OK... but if I go 11 Km/h more over then you are a danger.... paaaleeze! how does that make sense.. the problems for Ontario drivers, especially GTA residents are;


1 - Poorly educated drivers
2 - People doing 15 things in their cars, except driving
3 - people who are scared to drive
4 - unsafe cars on the road
5 - hot shots

how can we fix this...

make it VERY hard to get a license and expensive.... it's VERY expensive in Germany....I heard it was over 1000 euro to get it... put in a 3 strike rule... if you are 100% at fault causing 3 accidents in 3 years, then your license is gone for 5 years... start to crack down on cars that are rust buckets and unsafe cars too... MTO does it for trucks, why not cars? if you get some of the bad drivers off the road, then maybe you won't have as many hot shots trying to get through traffic...

the gov't is a business... ( here goes my unibomber mind set ) and they do not give two shiots about any of us... they won't hire more people to patrol and educate.. they will squeeze what they can out from what they have.... putting no money into our safety... but increasing their wages by 25% with the $$$.. waaaay above a COLA inscrease that I get, by the way. But... I can't blame them... no one in this province gives a shiot... it's that sheep mentality....so I say..

PUT UP A FIGHT OR SHUT THE FALK UP!

if someone is really going to get organized.. do it... if not, then what's the point of even arguing and whinning? oh ya.. I know why... b/c that's all the TREE HUGGING CALK SWALLOGISTS DO IN THIS COUNTRY... tip toe tip toe around the issues!

*thmbsdwn*


Then why dont we all get organized and do something? I'm game if you guys are!

Chris de la Cruz
10-30-2007, 08:40 PM
^^^ thats what the track/ autocross is for.

BimmerboyPH
10-30-2007, 08:42 PM
^^^ thats what the track/ autocross is for.

Unfortunatly there aren't many tracks close to me.

Chris de la Cruz
10-30-2007, 08:49 PM
Toronto Motorsports Park isn't that far. (Hamilton). CASC, PITTL has some autocross events there in Burlington/ oakville. Actually many car clubs in the area should have some autocross events.

BimmerboyPH
10-30-2007, 08:53 PM
Well i actually didint know that, thx. But still something needs to be done.

Arash
10-30-2007, 09:06 PM
I know what needs to be done! keep your eyes open for cop cars and when you spot cops spotting you doing something stupid, disappear into the woods! AXXE knows what I mean :cool:

Axxe
10-30-2007, 09:10 PM
I know what needs to be done! keep your eyes open for cop cars and when you spot cops spotting you doing something stupid, disappear into the woods! AXXE knows what I mean :cool:

Hammer down and into the rhubarb *rockout*

enfield
10-30-2007, 09:26 PM
Then why dont we all get organized and do something? I'm game if you guys are!

How about a petition to increase the limit on the 400 series highways to 120 as a starter. It used to be that before the oil issues of the 70's.

My actual suggestion would be to leave the limit at 100kph on the 400 series highways that are inside city limits but increase the limit to 140kph outside city limits. We could use:
http://www.petitiononline.com/
to get the signatures and then go from there.

For example there is a petition already out for modded cars: http://www.petitiononline.com/sect1722/petition.html

What do you guys think??

Boots R
10-30-2007, 09:32 PM
Hammer down and into the rhubarb *rockout*

wtf? Details?

Axxe
10-30-2007, 10:04 PM
What happens in K/W, stays in K/W. Except herpes, that shit follows you around.

El Gato Liso
10-30-2007, 10:26 PM
Haha, whenever we go down I'm attacking the mountains in a Sienna. It's literally bigger than the mini-busses, and can outrun 95% of the other cars. Nothing is funnier than ruining some dude in a modded sport compact on a mountain road (with no guardrail) in a massive minivan with 7 people inside.

Jay

yea man the mountains are the shit always loved the runs up the hills when i was a youth
especially the drives to ochi from kingston...thats another story

my ucnle use to drive an A4, now drives a 528i and my cousin drives a Z3 both in jamaica, and my other unlce had a 2.7i mod to his e30 but he got a next bimma a 535i, and he also has a subaru wrx rally adaptable so hes in gear 5 in no time! its also turbo charged. all of their cars are fine...i guess cuz they lived there their entire lives

im going to record me driing my ucnles subaru when i go this christmas and hopefully the Z3


anyway, back on topic *uzi* :moon:

Old_School
10-30-2007, 10:38 PM
I've been driving for nearly 30 years, and driven in 9 of 10 Provinces, Europe (lived there 5 years) the Middle East (lived there 4 years), driven in/through about 10 US states, parts of Africa, and yes, Jamaica.

Some of you youngsters don't seem to get it.

1. Cops aren't bad. They have a job to do. Some might power-trip a bit (or a lot) but I get the feeling some of you'd do the same if the roles were reversed.

2. Speed doesn't kill. The rapid loss of speed kills.

3. Excessive speed is a symptom of bad driving, and what's "excessive" is related to the road conditions, the vehicle conditions and the driver's skill.

4. Most drivers think they're better drivers than they really are.

5. When someone out drives his vehicle or talent and crashes, it isn't an "accident." It's a numbnuts decision on the part of the driver who failed. It's like "I was cleaning my gun and it went off." You're a dick.

6. Our highways can sustain a higher speed limit than posted. Don't come whining about road maint and bad drivers - Nairobi Kenya has shitty roads and bad drivers. Lebanon has shitty roads and bad drivers. Canada does not.

7. There are measures that can be taken to improve traffic and safety on our roads.
a. apply the rule of "reasonable and prudent". If you don't know what that is, turn in your driver's permit.
b. raise the 400-series highway speed limits to at least 110, but preferably the "85th percentile" rule. If you don't know what that means, turn in your permit.
c. apply graduated licences based on horsepower.
d. vehicle safety inspections at independent gov't inspection sites on a regular basis (I'd suggest every 2 years after the first 3 years a car is registered, until the 9 year mark, then annually). Car fails twice - impound and crushed. Shops that perform repairs cannot conduct inspections (too much potential for graft). Mods will be allowed, but have to be street legal. Sorry tuner boyz (and sorry you simple dickheads who want to shut off your DRLs and mount unsafe wheels on your "whip.")
e. make driver training actual training, not "pass the road test and parallel parking." It may cost a small fortune in crushed cones, but you can pass that on to the consumer.

Above all, traffic rules should be written for a balance of safety and traffic efficiency, not for social engineering. And traffic rules should be enforced - not just the easy ones like speed.

Arash
10-30-2007, 11:02 PM
good points. I bet the 85th percentile for the 400 series outside the city would be at least 110-120, and thats what the speed limit should be. I'm certain they've done such studies, it would be interesting to see the results.

Arash
10-30-2007, 11:17 PM
Bingo!!! some UofT researchers have done this study!! So I was almost right, 85% are driving between 110 - 130!!

http://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/678348/posts
The Case For Higher Speed Limits on Hwy. 401 (Trans-Canada Hwy)

Local News - Gord Thompson may be the only man in Ontario ever charged under the Highway Traffic Act for obeying the letter of the law. The teacher from Campbellford and another motorist caused a four-kilometre traffic jam on Highway 401 seven years ago by driving side by side at the posted 100 km/h speed limit. They were charged with obstructing traffic and had their licences temporarily suspended.

Weeks earlier, Thompson had been ticketed for going 117 km/h on the same road and staged his slow-motion protest after a judge told him he was breaking the law by going even a kilometre over the posted limit.

“It still kind of gets my blood going,” Thompson said this week. “The number on the [speed limit] sign isn’t the number you’re expected to drive at and no one will tell you what the tolerance actually is.” Thompson’s situation may be the most ludicrous application of Ontario’s speeding laws but it puts into focus what motorists prove with their right feet – that 100 km/h is often too slow for the province’s 400-series highways. A recent study by University of Toronto researcher Baher Abdulhai found every single driver exceeding the speed limit on some stretches of highway that he and graduate student Jaime Abraham studied. His study recommended that the speed limit be raised to a more realistic 130 km/h.

That finding mirrors dozens of similar studies done on expressways in North America and Europe. Studies indicate that 85 per cent of motorists drive at speeds between 110 km/h and 130 km/h on the 401. According to most traffic experts, such a widespread variance from the posted speed means the limit should be raised. And a survey of almost 300 motorists in Belleville several years ago found the majority of drivers wanted the speed limit increased by at least 10 km/h.

The provincial government, however, has dismissed the latest study, saying it has no intention of raising speed limits. “Our own research suggests that raising the speed limits would in fact lead to an increase in traffic injuries and fatalities,” said Transportation Ministry spokesman Anser Ahmed. The response to his study has disappointed Abdulhai. “I have not seen any counter-arguments based on fact,” he said this week. “It’s all been, ‘You’re going to kill people,’ [or] ‘There would be blood all over the roads.’” He was particularly upset by some media reports on his findings.

“What surprised me was the reaction from the public [in TV reports],” he said.“In one report, they showed a 50-50 split among people about the higher limit, but in some locations measured in the report, 100 per cent of people were driving over the limit. “If 100 per cent of the people are violating [the law] when they drive, where’s the 50 per cent that opposes higher limits?” The 100 km/h limit was set in the 1970s as a conservation measure during the oil crisis. Before that, the limit was 115 km/h, even though cars had few of the safety features that today’s drivers enjoy.

Scrapped limit
The United States scrapped its gas-saving 55 mph limit several years ago and left it to the states to set speed limits. Most opted for a 65 or even 75 mph (105 to 120 km/h) limit on major highways. Since then, people on both sides of the issue have been producing studies. Critics of higher speed limits point to an increased number of deaths on some highways with higher limits. Supporters say raising speed limits actually makes highways safer. They argue higher speeds encourage motorists to use the road more. With increased traffic, the number of fatalities per 100 million miles driven – one of the basic measures of road safety – actually falls. “It’s one of those cases where you use statistics any way you want to,” said David Leonhardt of the Canadian Automobile Association, which supported Abdulhai’s conclusions if combined with a program of increased speed limit enforcement.

Michael Cain, director of research for the B.C. group Safety by Education Not Speed Enforcement (SENSE), said the group’s efforts to raise speed limits drew the same fears of carnage on the roads. “They said ‘The faster you go, the harder you hit,’ but that totally ignores the human interaction of driving,” he said. “The whole argument ignores the fact that if you don’t have an accident, you don’t get hurt.”

Abdulhai himself says higher speeds are not dangerous and that speed differentials cause accidents. A higher speed limit, he argues, will not cause people to drive faster; it merely reflects what they are already doing. “It’s really basic stuff,” Abdulhai said. “It’s not rocket science.”

‘Reasonable’
Jim Baxter, president of the National Motorists Association, a U.S. consumers group that supports higher speed limits, said he was familiar with Abdulhai’s study. “What your professor is saying is set the speed limit at the speed at which traffic is moving, which I think is a reasonable and prudent thing to do,” he said. “People don’t have a death wish. You’re not out to hurt yourself or to drive faster than is safe for the road.” Most of the resistance to higher limits comes from police and the insurance companies, which both profit from speeding tickets, he said.

“Police like the low limit because it gives them a reason to stop anyone they want,” he said. “The insurance industry has always supported lower limits.” The other knock at the higher limits is that cars use more fuel at higher speeds. Baxter shrugs off that point. “Modern vehicles don’t have nearly the differential in fuel consumption that they used to,” he said. “It’s an argument that might have held sway in ’75 … [But] the individual should be allowed to decide if the saving of time is worth it.”

Baxter said he is familiar with environmental arguments but that highway policy shouldn’t be based on ideology. “There are side elements out there who don’t like people having the right to go anywhere they want however fast they want to go,” he said. “There are environmentalists who would like to see us walk everywhere.”

Leonhardt of the CAA said a higher limit on the 401 would allow police to concentrate on the very fast and the very slow drivers, who present the most danger in traffic. Those who drive over the limit should receive “zero tolerance,” he said. “And for people who want to drive 80, maybe a 400-series highway is not where they ought to be.” Baxter noted that realistic speed limits would be welcomed by motorists in Kingston, for it would dramatically cut down on travel times to Toronto or Ottawa.

Higher speeds are not only safer, but economically beneficial, argued SENSE’s Cain. “What we need to look at in this issue is where will society benefit?” he said. “[Higher speed limits] can reduce the number of crashes and provide benefits to the economy.” Leeds-Grenville MPP Bob Runciman, who has had a 600-km round-trip commute for 21 years, has publicly supported a higher speed limit on the 401, as did former transportation minister Al Palladini, but the issue has never caught fire at Queen’s Park. The last push to raise the limit dissolved after a rash of accidents involving wheels flying off heavy trucks.

As for Thompson, he has not had a speeding ticket since he and his companion set out on their legal Sunday drive, but he’d love to go back in front of a judge. “You know, when we did the protest at 100, we did not overtake one single vehicle,” he recalled. “If I get a ticket for going 120 on the 401 now, I’d go before the judge and say ‘I can’t go at 100, another judge told me I can’t drive 100 on the 401.’” Leonhardt said that incongruity needs to be addressed. “That’s the predicament that people are in right now, and people shouldn’t be in that predicament.”

Mystikal
10-31-2007, 07:45 PM
yea man the mountains are the shit always loved the runs up the hills when i was a youth
especially the drives to ochi from kingston...thats another story

my ucnle use to drive an A4, now drives a 528i and my cousin drives a Z3 both in jamaica, and my other unlce had a 2.7i mod to his e30 but he got a next bimma a 535i, and he also has a subaru wrx rally adaptable so hes in gear 5 in no time! its also turbo charged. all of their cars are fine...i guess cuz they lived there their entire lives

im going to record me driing my ucnles subaru when i go this christmas and hopefully the Z3


anyway, back on topic *uzi* :moon:

Haha that's hilarious, the run from Ochi to Kingston is basically what I'm talking about. Speicifically the run all the way up to Boston Bay.

Good idea on the recording, maybe I'll do some filming this year too. Anyone who has never seen the roads will be blown away.

Jay

Old_School
11-02-2007, 08:37 PM
Haha that's hilarious, the run from Ochi to Kingston is basically what I'm talking about. Speicifically the run all the way up to Boston Bay.

Good idea on the recording, maybe I'll do some filming this year too. Anyone who has never seen the roads will be blown away.

Jay

Film or not, it really has to be experienced. To be honest, it was some of the most fun driving I've done, and it was an a Nissan X-Trail.

VWIRUS
11-03-2007, 11:31 AM
you have some good points... a lot of younger , inexperienced, I just watched a movie rice burners do drive like that... but this law ain't gonna do SHIOT!

there are still late night runs... there are still people doing burn outs.. there are still people driving in / out of traffic... it hasn't changed a thing... so, I can drive like a looser at 140km/h and I am OK... but if I go 11 Km/h more over then you are a danger.... paaaleeze! how does that make sense.. the problems for Ontario drivers, especially GTA residents are;


1 - Poorly educated drivers
2 - People doing 15 things in their cars, except driving
3 - people who are scared to drive
4 - unsafe cars on the road
5 - hot shots
how can we fix this...

make it VERY hard to get a license and expensive.... it's VERY expensive in Germany....I heard it was over 1000 euro to get it... put in a 3 strike rule... if you are 100% at fault causing 3 accidents in 3 years, then your license is gone for 5 years... start to crack down on cars that are rust buckets and unsafe cars too... MTO does it for trucks, why not cars? if you get some of the bad drivers off the road, then maybe you won't have as many hot shots trying to get through traffic...


THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!!! you took the FREAKIN words outta my mouth!!! Couldnt have said it any better!!!

Betray
11-03-2007, 12:12 PM
Its all about money.

Bingo.

bmdbley'sBro
11-03-2007, 12:25 PM
How about a petition to increase the limit on the 400 series highways to 120 as a starter. It used to be that before the oil issues of the 70's.

My actual suggestion would be to leave the limit at 100kph on the 400 series highways that are inside city limits but increase the limit to 140kph outside city limits. We could use:
http://www.petitiononline.com/
to get the signatures and then go from there.

For example there is a petition already out for modded cars: http://www.petitiononline.com/sect1722/petition.html

What do you guys think??
I think we need to draft a motherfawking Petition!! *th-up*

actually striker & I were discussing this the other day (petitions)
that other petition has almost 14,000 sigs on it..

BimmerboyPH
11-04-2007, 12:02 AM
I think we need to draft a motherfawking Petition!! *th-up*

actually striker & I were discussing this the other day (petitions)
that other petition has almost 14,000 sigs on it..


What other petition??

bmdbley'sBro
11-04-2007, 12:30 PM
What other petition??

mufflers, nos & suspension re-allowance

enfield; "For example there is a petition already out for modded cars:
http://www.petitiononline.com/sect1722/petition.html
What do you guys think??"

enfield
11-04-2007, 03:14 PM
mufflers, nos & suspension re-allowance

enfield; "For example there is a petition already out for modded cars:
http://www.petitiononline.com/sect1722/petition.html
What do you guys think??"

The only way the Government will listen is if it costs them votes. Now - I think it will be very difficult for us to change the 50kph over the limit rule. I am afraid that we won't get too many takers amongst the grandma's and grandpa's of Ontario. I think a smarter idea would be to try and get the limit increased on the 400-series highways to 120kph. Then you would have to be doing 170kph to loose your car. The other issue is constitutional. The Police Officer gets to act as Judge, Jury, and Executioner. Your car & license are gone for a week before you get to see a judge in a court of law. Is this legal?

I am no lawyer. If there is a lawyer amongst us then he or she may be the best person to word the petition and answer my question about the Officer being the Judge, jury yadda, yadda, yadda....

InfinitiStyle
11-04-2007, 04:46 PM
Film or not, it really has to be experienced. To be honest, it was some of the most fun driving I've done, and it was an a Nissan X-Trail.

x-trails eh? Man id love to see mine in action on the mountain roads
do they have the turbo 2.5 AWD versions there?
My girl's uncle is up in Claringdon, they've had land there for years.
Jay let me know when your reaching yaad, me and the gyal are planning.
I wanna go to Asylum *uzi*

Boots R
11-04-2007, 05:06 PM
mufflers, nos & suspension re-allowance

enfield; "For example there is a petition already out for modded cars:
http://www.petitiononline.com/sect1722/petition.html
What do you guys think??"

When was suspension ever disallowed?

saix
11-04-2007, 06:49 PM
This year in my state if you're caught speeding you don't get the normal $5 for every mph over, instead they just hit you with a hardcore $1000+ fine.

JunzieB
11-05-2007, 11:12 AM
Haha that's hilarious, the run from Ochi to Kingston is basically what I'm talking about. Speicifically the run all the way up to Boston Bay.

Good idea on the recording, maybe I'll do some filming this year too. Anyone who has never seen the roads will be blown away.

Jay

LOL... You guys are going to make me cry*sad* All me and my bro talk about is the trip from Ochi to kingston that we had regularly on just about every weekend growing up. My dad was one hell of a driver, let's just say that if we drove even half as what they do down there we would be dubbed CRAAAZY on these canadian streets. Man i got stories but i'm not sure if people would say wow*love* or OMFG!:eek: LOL

Blades
11-05-2007, 11:40 AM
Abdulhai himself says higher speeds are not dangerous and that speed differentials cause accidents. A higher speed limit, he argues, will not cause people to drive faster; it merely reflects what they are already doing. Its really basic stuff, Abdulhai said. Its not rocket science.

Talk about hitting the nail on the dot. if 50 percent speed and the other 50 dont then there will be a huge gap in speed which will cause accidents. I see so many idiots in the fast lane doing the limit .. its for passing .. move out of the way. If slow people just stayed out of the fast lane then maybe people wouldnt change lanes so much.

speed would kill at 60km 80km .. its all fate and how it happens so it doesnt matter if there were an increase in speed and with cars being more developed then back in the day it should be easier to stop. All new cars as far as I can tell have disc brakes in the rear unlike the old drum brake system.

Bartacus
11-05-2007, 03:15 PM
Talk about hitting the nail on the dot. if 50 percent speed and the other 50 dont then there will be a huge gap in speed which will cause accidents. I see so many idiots in the fast lane doing the limit .. its for passing .. move out of the way. If slow people just stayed out of the fast lane then maybe people wouldnt change lanes so much.

Damn right!! Preach on brother! :)

While we're on the subject of this dumb ****ing law, I have a suggestion (not that anyone would listen or care): people should be allowed to have their cars certified to go a certain speed. Let me explain my wet dream:

Our government would set up authorized car-check places, which would cost us nothing. We take our cars there once a year for a full examination. This would include suspension checking, tires, brakes, headlights, the whole 9 yards. An EXHAUSTIVE checkup, including skid pad tests and hard braking tests. Depending on the results, your car would get a big number on the windshiled in the upper right corner, ie 150. Meaning that your car was certified to be able to go 150KM/h legally. That way, if some old **** rolls in with a typical old-man car (ie Buick/Caddy) wearing all-season tires, he only gets a 110, or even less. The kicker: if you don't rate at LEAST 130KM/H, you are NOT ALLOWED IN THE ****ING PASSING LANE. Any 110 rated person caught in the passing lane would be fined $10,000 and lose his car for a week. No questions asked, no second chances. If you wanna pass people, upgrade your brakes, spend money on REAL TIRES, not ****ing all seasons!!

This is my dream, although I should add that anyone running all-seaons would be shot and killed. Okay, maybe thats a bit harsh. Jail for 30 days then. :)

Bart

jstalin
11-05-2007, 03:39 PM
Our government would set up authorized car-check places, which would cost us nothing. We take our cars there once a year for a full examination. This would include suspension checking, tires, brakes, headlights, the whole 9 yards. An EXHAUSTIVE checkup, including skid pad tests and hard braking tests. Depending on the results, your car would get a big number on the windshiled in the upper right corner, ie 150. Meaning that your car was certified to be able to go 150KM/h legally. That way, if some old **** rolls in with a typical old-man car (ie Buick/Caddy) wearing all-season tires, he only gets a 110, or even less. The kicker: if you don't rate at LEAST 130KM/H, you are NOT ALLOWED IN THE ****ING PASSING LANE. Any 110 rated person caught in the passing lane would be fined $10,000 and lose his car for a week. No questions asked, no second chances. If you wanna pass people, upgrade your brakes, spend money on REAL TIRES, not ****ing all seasons!!


Because that would be very cost effective and enforceable :rolleyes:

Besides, isn't it already law that you have to have tires with equal to or higher speed rated tires than the manufacturer designated? Try finding a tire shop that will not put an S rated tire on a bmw

M3ti Compact
11-05-2007, 07:16 PM
There is a simple, cost effective, and environmentally friendly way to get rid of the majority of bad drivers out there: eliminate and ban automatic transmissions.

dbworld4k
11-05-2007, 07:43 PM
^ Lol!!!

Old_School
11-05-2007, 08:13 PM
Our government would set up authorized car-check places, which would cost us nothing. We take our cars there once a year for a full examination. This would include suspension checking, tires, brakes, headlights, the whole 9 yards. An EXHAUSTIVE checkup, including skid pad tests and hard braking tests. Depending on the results, your car would get a big number on the windshiled in the upper right corner, ie 150. Meaning that your car was certified to be able to go 150KM/h legally. That way, if some old **** rolls in with a typical old-man car (ie Buick/Caddy) wearing all-season tires, he only gets a 110, or even less. The kicker: if you don't rate at LEAST 130KM/H, you are NOT ALLOWED IN THE ****ING PASSING LANE. Any 110 rated person caught in the passing lane would be fined $10,000 and lose his car for a week. No questions asked, no second chances. If you wanna pass people, upgrade your brakes, spend money on REAL TIRES, not ****ing all seasons!!

That's a bit harsh. Here's my "wet dream:"

1. All cars are subject to an annual safety inspection at the owner's cost. The inspection points are not run by people who can perform the "necessary repairs." If you can't afford to keep the car on the road, it's time to start saving bus fare. Safety points inspected include (but aren't limited to) tires, brakes, suspension, lights, glass and any "mods" that affect the safety of the vehicle. At the same time you will go through the "air care" regime, though a more sensible one than the cash grab currently in place. Exceptions will only be for "classic" or "special interest" cars that are insured as such: i.e. not daily drivers, and will only apply if the car is period correct or completely original. cars that fail have one chance to be repaired to pass. second failure is impound and destruction - at owner's expense.

2. Graduated license based on horsepower. The existing graduated regime stays in place with the following addition: anyone with an L permit is prohibited from driving a vehicle with more than 170 hp unless it is in a "working" category (i.e. a truck that hauls shit). Greater than 170 HP is prohibited until the driver has had a G permit for 24 months or more. All drivers must complete a written "rules of the road" exam in order to renew their permits. Failure consequences include reduction of class to loss of permit. Cost accrues to the driver - if you can't afford to be on the road, get those bus tokens.

3. Enforcement concentrates on erratic and unsafe driving, regardless of speed. Lane discipline is legally enforced - rechts gefahren.

By the way, this isn't new or untried.

Bartacus
11-06-2007, 08:17 AM
Because that would be very cost effective and enforceable :rolleyes:

Besides, isn't it already law that you have to have tires with equal to or higher speed rated tires than the manufacturer designated? Try finding a tire shop that will not put an S rated tire on a bmw

Like cost effective and enforceable mean anything. Please. All I want is to get slow rude mother****ers out of the passing lane. You want cost effective? Let me be able to legally shoot them. I'll buy the gun and pay for the bullets. No cost except emotional pain to my victims families. :D

Bart

JunzieB
11-06-2007, 10:08 AM
That's a bit harsh. Here's my "wet dream:"

2. Graduated license based on horsepower. The existing graduated regime stays in place with the following addition: anyone with an L permit is prohibited from driving a vehicle with more than 170 hp unless it is in a "working" category (i.e. a truck that hauls shit). Greater than 170 HP is prohibited until the driver has had a G permit for 24 months or more. All drivers must complete a written "rules of the road" exam in order to renew their permits. Failure consequences include reduction of class to loss of permit. Cost accrues to the driver - if you can't afford to be on the road, get those bus tokens.

3. Enforcement concentrates on erratic and unsafe driving, regardless of speed. Lane discipline is legally enforced - rechts gefahren.

By the way, this isn't new or untried.

I've had many dreams of this graduated license thing you speak of.*mw* I figured even if the government was after money they should just up the cost of the greater license. For example the G class enables you to travel on the highway at max speeds of 100kmh but then you may have one greater (like a //M class license LOL ) that enables you to go max 150km and so on. Yeah, yeah i know that's already the motorcycle but you get my point. Of course before getting that license one would have to go through a more rigorous driver training course like one of those performance driving schools*love* Of course this is not to promote speed but simply to teach the individual how to control it in the evnt that something were to go wrong. I'm just rambling on now and i've lost my train of thought becaus my boss came by so i'll take a breather and come back*th-up*

JunzieB
11-06-2007, 10:24 AM
Like cost effective and enforceable mean anything. Please. All I want is to get slow rude mother****ers out of the passing lane. You want cost effective? Let me be able to legally shoot them. I'll buy the gun and pay for the bullets. No cost except emotional pain to my victims families. :D

Bart

You sir are one sick puppy:eek: But if you're willing to do the dirty work, i'll support you:cool:

StikiGreenZ
11-06-2007, 10:30 AM
The problem won't be solved simply by giving someone a higher class license. The problem with travelling at high speeds on our highways lies in idiot drivers. At least 2-3 times a week, I get cut off by someone doing 40km/h while im doing 110 km/h on the 401. Speed differential on major highways is a more prominent cause of these accidents. You can't teach someone to react to other driver's mistakes because sometimes nothing can save you from someone cutting into your lane (especially when the lane you want to go over to is already occupied.)

Driver education as a whole needs to be increased. I've read a lot on the difficulties of obtaining a driver's permit in countries like Germany and I think we should implement their rigorous testing here, for ALL LICENSE CLASSES.

JunzieB
11-06-2007, 10:42 AM
The problem won't be solved simply by giving someone a higher class license. The problem with travelling at high speeds on our highways lies in idiot drivers. At least 2-3 times a week, I get cut off by someone doing 40km/h while im doing 110 km/h on the 401. Speed differential on major highways is a more prominent cause of these accidents. You can't teach someone to react to other driver's mistakes because sometimes nothing can save you from someone cutting into your lane (especially when the lane you want to go over to is already occupied.)

Driver education as a whole needs to be increased. I've read a lot on the difficulties of obtaining a driver's permit in countries like Germany and I think we should implement their rigorous testing here, for ALL LICENSE CLASSES.


I concur. I know i'm a young buck and i'm sure that a lot of ppl here are either the same age or older than i am. There may be a few that are younger but what i always think is this, you can see what the problem is and i can see what it is. Why is it so hard for the government to enforce this again:confused: ?

JunzieB
11-06-2007, 10:42 AM
The problem won't be solved simply by giving someone a higher class license. The problem with travelling at high speeds on our highways lies in idiot drivers. At least 2-3 times a week, I get cut off by someone doing 40km/h while im doing 110 km/h on the 401. Speed differential on major highways is a more prominent cause of these accidents. You can't teach someone to react to other driver's mistakes because sometimes nothing can save you from someone cutting into your lane (especially when the lane you want to go over to is already occupied.)

Driver education as a whole needs to be increased. I've read a lot on the difficulties of obtaining a driver's permit in countries like Germany and I think we should implement their rigorous testing here, for ALL LICENSE CLASSES.


I concur. I know i'm a young buck and i'm sure that a lot of ppl here are either the same age or older than i am. There may be a few that are younger but what i always think is this, you can see what the problem is and i can see what it is. Why is it so hard for the government to enforce this again:confused: ?

Bartacus
11-06-2007, 10:50 AM
The problem won't be solved simply by giving someone a higher class license. The problem with travelling at high speeds on our highways lies in idiot drivers. At least 2-3 times a week, I get cut off by someone doing 40km/h while im doing 110 km/h on the 401. Speed differential on major highways is a more prominent cause of these accidents. You can't teach someone to react to other driver's mistakes because sometimes nothing can save you from someone cutting into your lane (especially when the lane you want to go over to is already occupied.)

Driver education as a whole needs to be increased. I've read a lot on the difficulties of obtaining a driver's permit in countries like Germany and I think we should implement their rigorous testing here, for ALL LICENSE CLASSES.

THIS man speaks the truth! Germany is the model we should follow.

In case its not obvious guys, I'm only kidding about the violence in my above posts. I work for cops, but I have a sick sense of humor. :) I wasn't being serious in any way. Rudeness is a bit of a "pet peeve" of mine. Actually, if I'm being honest, lane hogging is more than that to me. To quote God, known on earth as George Carlin, "I don't have pet peeves, I have major ****ing psychotic hatreds". :D

The only serious solution to the idiocy on Ontarios highways is what StikiGreenZ said: driver education. I just wish people would realize how RUDE it is to hog the passing lane! The total lack of driving manners enrages me some days!

Bart

jstalin
11-06-2007, 11:01 AM
The only serious solution to the idiocy on Ontarios highways is what StikiGreenZ said: driver education. I just wish people would realize how RUDE it is to hog the passing lane! The total lack of driving manners enrages me some days!


Instead of our current graduated licensing system, we should simply make it law that in order to do your drivers license test you've got to complete 6 months of a certified driving instruction. That would go a long way in terms of lowering the accident rate