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View Full Version : Racing law could cause more chases


europrince
10-19-2007, 11:00 AM
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/driving/story.html?id=58c426b9-1db1-4167-8f42-4e32e656a25f

David Booth
National Post


Friday, October 19, 2007


Politicians can be so stupid. Imagine, for a moment, that you've been transported back in time to the Middle Ages. Times are tough, what with serfdom, various famines and the whole feudal system thing. Food is scarce and tough times beget (that's me being learned, by the way) tough measures. There's a rash of bread thievery happening and the local sheriff-cum-tyrant is determined to be tough on crime.

But, like politicians throughout the ages, actually looking like he's doing something is far more important than actually doing something. So, to assuage the various lords, counts and minor potentates that are getting their sourdough in a bunch, he passes a law that bread pilfering will be henceforth punished by death. Drastic measures to be sure, but, hey, little Lord Fontleroy didn't get his breakfast croissant the Friday before last.

Unfortunately for you, in travelling through the time portal, you get morphed into one medieval-type badass teenager from the wrong side of the moat. Dad's off to the crusades, mom's on the cider and you're the only breadwinner. No money in pocket and with 13 younger mouths to feed (remember there was no television or Playstation back then), you break into Ye Olde Bakery to scrounge the morning's toast. Unfortunately, Bobby the policeman happens upon your misappropriating ways. The jig's up, you're going down, it's the gallows in the town square for you.

Or maybe not. And all of you, dear readers, being very modern types, are surely seeing the flaw in the argument. With the penalty for killing the policeman and escaping no worse than taking the bread, there's very little reason for our mythical Robin Hood to stick around. He's no worse off if he, um, offs the copper and he just might, considering the lack of CSI in those days, get off scott-free.

Now, fast-forward half a millennium or so. You're an equally testosterone-fuelled teenager but you're all hip and stuff, what with your iPod Nano and a hot-rodded Corvette (with optional K & N Filtercharger kit and mondo rims, I might add). You're cruising, illegally you know, at a buck-sixty when all of a sudden (as these occasions are wont to be) you spot the flashing reds in your rear-view. At the same moment, you pass one of the 401's new signs. You know the ones: They say for 50 kilometres an hour over the speed limit, you are subject to a maximum $10,000 fine, immediate licence suspension and the impounding of your vehicle.

So, let's see. If you stop, you'll get fined big bucks, lose your car and get your licence suspended. And if you run, you'll get a ... big fine, lose your car and get your licence suspended. Of course, the second choice also contains the possibility that you might just get off scott-free. Which do you think the average teenager is going to choose?

I'm 49 years old now, have RRSPs, a mortgage and a kid I have to put through university. I would, of course, stop, face the consequences and impress upon my 23-year-old that the law must always be obeyed. But, when I was 19, you can bet your ass that I would have scampered faster than you can say a Ninja ZX-12R has 172 horsepower and good luck catching me, you Dodge-driving, doughnut-eating flatfoot. And don't be talking to me about helicopters. Damned few can keep up with a Dodge Viper at full chat.

So, here's my fearful prediction. After the initial crackdown passes, our constabulary will start enforcing this new "racing" law selectively. Soccer moms and dads in Dodge Caravans will be let off since they obviously "didn't mean" to race. Young turks in slammed Civics and riding superbikes, however, will have to be "taught a lesson." The news of this discrimination will spread like wildfire. Feeling (wrongly) that they have nothing to lose, more of them will scamper at the sight of the gendarmes. There will more car chases than ever. And there will be no reduction in the number of fatalities caused by street racing.

So that we are absolutely clear on this, let me categorically state that any speed competition on public roads is wrong. Street racing is illegal, immoral and, as two more innocent bystanders found out recently, it can be deadly. Anyone involved in such activities should be charged as such and feel the full weight of the law.

But racing, by definition, requires that two or more vehicles be competing. Trying to stretch that definition to anyone driving alone on a highway at 50 km/h over the speed limit is simply foolish. Worse yet, I fear it will turn out to be bad governance.

dbooth@nationalpost.com

National Post 2007

europrince
10-19-2007, 11:01 AM
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/driving/story.html?id=c4a7b45f-1dde-45eb-a044-1892d7473243

David Booth, National Post
Published: Friday, October 19, 2007
According to the Ontario Provincial Police, 179 drivers were charged two weekends ago under the new street racing law that sees a seven-day suspension of one's licence, the impounding of one's vehicle for seven days and a minimum fine of $2,000 for travelling more than 50 kilometres an hour over the speed limit. Extrapolated over six months, that means almost 5,000 motorists will have been involved in "racing activities," all to catch a very small minority of drivers that are actually racing. Methinks the new law is very much like arming a mouse trap with an 88-millimetre howitzer.




National Post 2007

kevin325
10-19-2007, 11:12 AM
this shit is ridiculous....

propr'one
10-19-2007, 11:16 AM
The biggest problem is this.

At 150+, its now ABSOLUTELY worth it to run. Go ahead, encourage kids who think they're invincible to push that turbo civic to 240.

smart move, ontario government.

Dr. Flyview
10-19-2007, 11:23 AM
Wow.

You will not believe what I just heard from an OPP officer last night. He was bragging how much MONEY they are making with this new law. He also said the tow-trucking business is way up. VEEEERY NAICE! That was the whole point wasn't it guys?

Soldo
10-19-2007, 11:32 AM
Obviously the whole point is money, but at least the assholes are admitting it!

I miss the days of driving 160km/h on the open stretches of highway late at night. I stick to regular roads now, cause the highway's no fun at 120!

diezel06turk
10-19-2007, 11:37 AM
this is ridicilous, i dont even want to buy a bike anymore

StikiGreenZ
10-19-2007, 11:39 AM
Totally ridiculous... I heard cops can't chase past 160 km/h... Doesn't matter cause they'll probably just radio ahead. Plus, I doubt they'd give you up even if they're not allowed to exceed 160 km/h.

europrince
10-19-2007, 11:40 AM
Totally ridiculous... I heard cops can't chase past 160 km/h... Doesn't matter cause they'll probably just radio ahead. Plus, I doubt they'd give you up even if they're not allowed to exceed 160 km/h.

I think you're right.

Dr. Flyview
10-19-2007, 11:53 AM
Since the new law came in, I have honestly not gone 50 over, but seriously now, are your chances of getting away that good? Are they more or less than 50%? Can we discuss what sort of equipment they have in order to pursue the fugitive for a successful "score"?

Also, what are the exact penalties for going 50 over, then engaging the chase, and then getting caugh AFTER the chase?

Boots R
10-19-2007, 12:04 PM
Totally ridiculous... I heard cops can't chase past 160 km/h... Doesn't matter cause they'll probably just radio ahead. Plus, I doubt they'd give you up even if they're not allowed to exceed 160 km/h.

Trust me, they will still chase above 160km.

kevin325
10-19-2007, 12:07 PM
Trust me, they will still chase above 160km.

Kev,

what happened bro?? :(

Aveman
10-19-2007, 12:46 PM
I'm glad that the obvious faults of this new law are being brought into the public eye.

Most of the definitions of a "driving stunt" in this new law are purely subjective, it bothers me that a cop can do so much damage to you just on his judgment call alone. "Do you know why I pulled you over? You were (driving in a way that prevents others from passing)." So minimum $2000 fine, storage fees of about $50 per day and $200 for the tow plus you loose your license and car for seven days. All this from the judgment of one cop, all you need is one asshole cop in a bad mood that thinks your car "looks fast".

I say get rid of all the subjective BS in the new law and keep it at 50km/h on the street and 70 km/h on the highway. If your going 50 over on the streets your an idiot and probably deserve the penalties, but 50 over on the highway isn't enough, if your in the left lane going 125-130 and a car is ridding your ass to get out of the way and there are cars in the middle lane you have to go over 140 to get out of their way. Not enough buffer there for average highway situation. It's only safe to go with the flow of traffic, so most people on the highway are going 125-130 now days and you need to go at least 10 km/h more to pass someone within a reasonable time and with a reasonable distance.

If you go 115 in the middle lane I believe your chances of an accident are higher because people are passing you left right and centre and when they pass they barely clear you as they come back in, going 120 in the left lane leaves you in the situation I listed above and going 110 in the right lane your just getting in the way of people trying to merge on the highway.

Anyway the general public will become annoyed and make a stink eventually, throw in a few deaths from teenagers running and cops chasing and this law won't remain as it is now. *no-no*

Souvrain
10-19-2007, 12:54 PM
i got chase a few time one time i got caught ! im in quebec do so its the SQ (surete du quebec) its are opp .. anyway .. the guy told me why your runing bla bla bla .. he say (this made me lol) you dont look like a jerk ! so im gona let you go this time so i got away whit 600$ ticket and 9 point less on my driver liscense! lol because i was in a tox and my car look clean ...bullshit! anyway ... as for the Ontario the new law is shit them police cruiser are as shitty as the law .. so get a turbo m3 or go to jail ! peace ps: oh yeah or just get a police scanner and radar jammer and a 100liter fuel cell ;)

AVEMAN your f*** right ! right on

M3ti Compact
10-19-2007, 02:00 PM
I would consider running at even 130 or 140 because what is to stop the cop from saying you were doing 150? Absolutely nothing. All they know is young asian + BMW = 50km/h over guilty until proven innocent.

bmwm5lover
10-19-2007, 02:17 PM
I agree with the points brought up. To me, this shit is rediculous.
I owuld definitely consider running from the cop, penalties seem to be pretty much the same.

Mystikal
10-19-2007, 02:48 PM
All they know is young asian + BMW = 50km/h over guilty until proven innocent.

Please stop with this. I've seen you mention it before, and statistically it's just not true. I've seen Canadian data showing that Asians are the LEAST pulled over group per capita (yes, less than Whites).

The Black pullover rate was something like 2.5 times that of the Asian rate. And, unfortunately, my personal experience reflects this data accurately.

Jay

Sa///M3
10-19-2007, 03:12 PM
:)


That's a nervous smile.

europrince
10-19-2007, 03:23 PM
I agree with the points brought up. To me, this shit is rediculous.
I owuld definitely consider running from the cop, penalties seem to be pretty much the same.

problem is evading police is a criminal offence.

Boots R
10-19-2007, 03:28 PM
problem is evading police is a criminal offence.

So is going over 50.

jstalin
10-19-2007, 03:32 PM
So is going over 50.

No, it's a provincial law.

But running is a criminal offence, and if it's your car they'll just come to your house the next day and issue you your summons, so it's pretty pointless running. If it's not your car, it's a different story

Boots R
10-19-2007, 03:40 PM
No, it's a provincial law.

But running is a criminal offence, and if it's your car they'll just come to your house the next day and issue you your summons, so it's pretty pointless running. If it's not your car, it's a different story

pfft, close enough.


And what if they are on the side of the highway doing radar? Pretty sure if you're speeding it's going to be hard to get a licence plate.

bmdbley'sBro
10-19-2007, 04:17 PM
you can Get lcd plate covers that jsut go black -whole plate Black..



anyways i'm not reading enough about Protest or even dissenting opion's ...

we have yet to read any articles from say a charter lawyer...


ont gov just sucked $358,000.00 bux out of peoples pockets
tower's will be at around $179,000.00

in less then 1 month *thmbsdwn*

kevin325
10-19-2007, 04:19 PM
you can Get lcd plate covers that jsut go black -whole plate Black..



anyways i'm not reading enough about Protest or even dissenting opion's ...

we have yet to read any articles from say a charter lawyer...


ont gov just sucked $358,000.00 bux out of peoples pockets
tower's will be at around $179,000.00

in less then 1 month *thmbsdwn*

Link to this now or ban.

Boots R
10-19-2007, 04:22 PM
ont gov just sucked $358,000.00 bux out of peoples pockets
tower's will be at around $179,000.00


it's also $2,000 MINIMUM. they can milk as much as 10 grand out of any victims of this law.

SamE30e
10-19-2007, 04:26 PM
Totally ridiculous... I heard cops can't chase past 160 km/h... Doesn't matter cause they'll probably just radio ahead. Plus, I doubt they'd give you up even if they're not allowed to exceed 160 km/h.

They can't chase past 200km/h. But you're right, you can't beat a radio.

BimmerboyPH
10-19-2007, 05:46 PM
Its plain and simple if you think they haven't read your plate, **** em and make a break for it. All I Know is that this new law hasn't stopped me, YOU HEAR THAT U PIGS YOUR NEW LAW HASN'T STOPPED ME!

I must say I am interested in these LCD plate covers.

someguy
10-19-2007, 06:39 PM
that was one of the first things i thought....most teens going 50 over will just gun it if they see the flashing red an blues...most likely causing more accidents/fatalities.

dbworld4k
10-19-2007, 06:50 PM
that was one of the first things i thought....most teens going 50 over will just gun it if they see the flashing red an blues...most likely causing more accidents/fatalities.

If that's what it takes.

Trekz
10-20-2007, 12:55 AM
so from now on we all must drive 50 over and when see red lights gun it. So they get rid of this.

MP328
10-20-2007, 01:53 AM
this is exactly what i was thinking too, if u get in the situation, might as well run.

and from personal experience u have about 30 sec to disappear, if ur not gone from the cop in those first couple of seconds ur fuked most likely lol

bmdbley'sBro
10-20-2007, 02:27 AM
Link to this now or ban.

so you want to know how to instantly hide your plate, eh!? :D


cool heres a bunch of different ways
http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/LCD_20License_20Plate
http://www.halfbakery.com/idea/Alterable_20License_20Plate

http://www.hideaplate.com/h/hideaplate/pic.cfm

europrince
10-20-2007, 05:58 PM
^ James Bond :D

propr'one
10-20-2007, 06:02 PM
man, i was doing 235 cruising through I-90 in new york yesterday (on M+S tires *shiner* ).

i hate ****ing stupid socalist police state canada

europrince
10-20-2007, 06:03 PM
^ no state troopers?

Jim .E.
10-20-2007, 10:02 PM
Ontario is getting corrupt day in day out... I'm moving once I'm done university.

AMG_POWER
10-20-2007, 10:19 PM
Ontario is getting corrupt day in day out... I'm moving once I'm done university.

where'd ya go?

dbworld4k
10-20-2007, 10:22 PM
Ontario is getting corrupt day in day out... I'm moving once I'm done university.

lol same here. One more year and I'm heading stateside :D

Boss17
10-21-2007, 02:09 AM
LOL i know so many people, mostly young, who are moving to the states for so many reasons related to our bullshit laws, government, employment, etc etc. the list goes on and on and on.

I'm moving to the states in a few years also.

JMW
10-21-2007, 09:40 AM
move to england lol
police dont bother u here what so ever.

we got pulled over the other day for doin 30 over..
and they said...just slow down next time ya..

haha i love it

Meegis
10-21-2007, 11:22 AM
All of you guys thinking of going south, it really isn't much better. Since most of you just visit, you dont realize what it is really like.

The laws are in terms more leniant, and this is due to Ontario going on a powertrip, but you will find out that police are more abundant and less considerate.

Tickets are a pain in the ass, and for the most part, NEVER come off your record, as they do in Ontario after 3-5 years.

Jim .E.
10-21-2007, 12:44 PM
where'd ya go?

If I'm staying in Canada: Calgary (lots of job opportunities right now), Vancouver, Winnipeg, anywhere but nothing north of Thunder Bay...shits too cold

IF I move to the U.S.: California, San Francisco, Dallas or Atlanta

in all honesty its just Ontario. Anywhere else would be fine. I give it about 5 years and Ontario will be just as corrupt as cops in India (I'm punjabi so I know what I'm talking about...and have experienced first hand).

tig
10-22-2007, 02:04 AM
ya defiantly moving to the U.S when i m done school too, wanna go somewhere warm so i can drive my bimmer all year around:cool: , this shit is just getting stupid, my buddy got his car taken away saturday night cuz the stupid cop decided that it was unsafe cuz it was too low. He drives a white e36 on h&r race springs his front bumper has a lip on it which makes the car look really low to the ground, He was stopped at a light on yonge/richmond and the cops pulled up next to him slapped him with a court date gave him a ticket and told him to get out of the car cuz it they had to tow it. It cost him $1200 after all the towing/inpound fees and he has to go to court at the end of november to show that the car is not as low anymore otherwise he cant drive it. Whatever happend to the old days when a cop would pull u over for some stupid shit like that or a loud exhaust or something and you would tell him sorry sir i m on my way to the mechanic right now to get the exhaust taken off and the cop would say ok just make sure you take it off or u ll get a ticket next time and let you go lol. Looks like my car is never goin downtown on a staturday night again cuz im running the same springs dont wanna get towed too. Ivan(propr'one) I think i want my H&R sports back lol jkn.

Yorkie
10-22-2007, 05:57 AM
If I'm staying in Canada: Calgary (lots of job opportunities right now), Vancouver, Winnipeg, anywhere but nothing north of Thunder Bay...shits too cold



Winterpeg in North of TBay and absolutely brutal in the winter. I've been there and I hated it and I don't usually mind winter weather.

europrince
10-22-2007, 09:46 AM
LOL i know so many people, mostly young, who are moving to the states for so many reasons related to our bullshit laws, government, employment, etc etc. the list goes on and on and on.


As a percentage of the population, they are almost zero. Every country has bullshit laws. You can't run from the law forever. At some point, you have to grow up and be a responsible citizen. Our government oversees the strongest economy we've had in years and the strongest economy in the G-8. That also answers your employment question. So to everyone that leaves Canada because you don't think its good enough for you, go jump off a bridge...outside this country so that we taxpayers don't have to use our resources to peel you off the ground.

Boots R
10-22-2007, 10:42 AM
lol, the US isn't any better. You guys will be running from one bad law in Ontario into a million bad ones in the US.

dbworld4k
10-22-2007, 10:45 AM
I'm not moving because of laws, that's such a stupid reason to move. Someone already pointed out that there is so much more police patrolling at any given time in the bigger states, the odds of being busted here are probably lower than down there in most regards.

IF I move there next year, it'll be because of Grad school admission and the subsequent job which normally ends up in the US, not because of some stupid HTA legislation.

hadesm5
10-22-2007, 11:33 AM
all this talk about engaging in a chase, i mean that never crossed mymind. i would just pull over. how many of you have ran away, how many times, and what was your success rate?

Boots R
10-22-2007, 11:39 AM
all this talk about engaging in a chase, i mean that never crossed mymind. i would just pull over. how many of you have ran away, how many times, and what was your success rate?

If they are following you, they probably already have your plate.

But if they are on the side of the road, you might have a chance.

europrince
10-22-2007, 11:46 AM
Ontario is getting corrupt day in day out... I'm moving once I'm done university.

Bro, for a university student, that is one ignorant comment. Sounds like you're corrupt, as you are milking our subsidized education system. Perhaps you like the US better, where you pay $20+/year for a good university. Maybe you should walk the walk.

europrince
10-22-2007, 11:48 AM
I'm not moving because of laws, that's such a stupid reason to move. Someone already pointed out that there is so much more police patrolling at any given time in the bigger states, the odds of being busted here are probably lower than down there in most regards.

IF I move there next year, it'll be because of Grad school admission and the subsequent job which normally ends up in the US, not because of some stupid HTA legislation.

At least someone here is talking intelligently.