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M-Power
10-12-2005, 09:17 PM
1997 BMW M3/4 , 139,000 kilometres.
Cosmos black, with black leather interior. The interior is mint.
Manual transmission, limited slip, ASC, power heated seats, etc...

-never winter driven. I will send undercarriage pictures.
-no modifications, no track days.
-BMW CD system and BMW remote keyless entry/alarm system (two keys
and remotes)

The car has brand new E46 M3 wheels with Michelin Pilot Sports.
The ////M Contour wheels are included.

Our family is expanding, the budget is shrinking, and we were dreaming to think an M3 would accomodate our needs at this stage in our life.

We are asking a conservative $23000.
Seeing the 95 grey market cars, modified, high mileage, unknown history cars on the Autotrader website, this is the best deal going.

Land Rover Discovery's are a possible trade. The car may be traded in soon to accomodate our next purchase, so don't hesitate to contact us.

Please e-mail for pictures. Tire kickers are welcome!

BMWags
10-12-2005, 10:42 PM
bump for a niagara bimmer!

propr'one
10-13-2005, 04:49 AM
Would you part the M3 rims? (i'll buy em with or without rubber and can trade you other e36 rims/tires)

PM me a price

jason
10-13-2005, 11:00 AM
pics to pimpintegra@hotmail.com

thanks

vertakul
10-13-2005, 12:16 PM
Would you part the M3 rims? (i'll buy em with or without rubber and can trade you other e36 rims/tires)

PM me a price

do you really think someone would ruin an M3 like that?

Antz_Marchin
10-13-2005, 12:46 PM
^^I think he was trying to part them earlier last week anyways.....plus, throwing contours on it isn't ruining it by any means.

M-Power
10-13-2005, 07:54 PM
I don't recall saying I would part the car. A few bolt ons were sold a few weeks ago.
I have a few lug nuts for sale if you want them. :P

M-Power
10-13-2005, 09:56 PM
Go to the BMW club website:
http://www.trillium-bmwclub.ca/trillium/forum/post.jsp?postid=802

ENJOY YOU VOYEURS *th-up*

Miguel
10-13-2005, 11:02 PM
Why the narrow grills?
http://www.trillium-bmwclub.ca/trillium/servlet/getblob?table=forum_images&id=269&filename=M3%20001.bmp

Antz_Marchin
10-14-2005, 01:17 AM
Sorry, wasn't saying that you were gonna part the car, but when the rims came into question, I thought that you had the E46 rims for sale with the other stuff last week. Ah no biggy, good luck with the sale, looks sweet.

M-Power
10-14-2005, 05:13 AM
Why the narrow grills?
http://www.trillium-bmwclub.ca/trillium/servlet/getblob?table=forum_images&id=269&filename=M3%20001.bmp

Why are you kissing your brother?
I don't what you're talking about, but don't 'jack my thread! *thmbsdwn*

Miguel
10-14-2005, 09:30 AM
Why are you kissing your brother?
I don't what you're talking about, but don't 'jack my thread! *thmbsdwn*
I kiss him because I'm an incestuous homo..

but besides that, your car's nose panel appears to have the kidney grills from the older bodystyle E36 series. They are narrow. 96+ E36 BMW's have a fatter kidney grill.

Im not jacking your thread as you so eloquently put it... i'm telling you that either your car was in a front end collision or someone decided to downgrade the front.

*wave*

seberschlag
10-14-2005, 11:17 AM
Nice looking car! I also am selling my 328i on this board! Good luck.

M-Power
10-14-2005, 07:26 PM
Miguel,
Are you an expert on M3 4 door cars?

You're a pain in the :moon: and have no business making such ridiculous comments.
Why can't you for once, stay the heck out of someone's thread? For a guy with almost 9000 posts, I can see why you have that count.

GET LOST!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jon@Bimmersport
10-14-2005, 07:51 PM
Ok since you wont clear that up things seem fishy, you dont know why the front grill is from a 92-95 3/M3? its not as simple as changing the grills the whole nose piece needs to be changed as well, so wats the story? i actually have a buyer interested (my boss at work) but i dunno if i should refer this if you dont wanna clear up an issue.

See this is a 1995 M3...note the front grills.

http://www.unofficialbmw.com/images/m3_eng.jpg


Now this is a 1996+ front end..

http://www.bmwpugetsound.com/member_cars/images/brown-m3-3.JPG

Me and Miguel are just lookin out for fellow members, seeing he has 9000 posts..and i have 12 000...that just means we know the members more than you do, and are jus being good friends. right guys?

rodo
10-14-2005, 08:02 PM
damn right! :D

M-Power
10-14-2005, 10:19 PM
Hey those are GREAT pictures of a two door M3, especially the 1995 because they never even landed in Canada.
The 96 or later car is especially nice, because if you read my post, the car is a 1997 ////M3 FOUR DOOR, with a full load luxury package.
The front end is totally different! The two door cars (COUPES) have different body panels, front end spoilers, and side panel spoilers.

Obviously Miguel told you to defend him with your 12,000 post count which shows you are both non experts and thread hijackers.

Are you the guy kissing Miguel in the avatar?

HOLY COW! LET IT GO GUYS!

I bet you have never seen an M3 sedan in person. The local dealer has never seen one before mine came in for an oil change!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

M-Power
10-14-2005, 10:25 PM
Me and Miguel are just lookin out for fellow members, seeing he has 9000 posts..and i have 12 000...that just means we know the members more than you do, and are jus being good friends. right guys?

For "E46 LOVER"

HOLY FAWK! You are 18 years old and list your car as "another members car"

You post 10 times daily, and call yourself a post whore.

Get off your parents computer and go get a job kiddo!

Jon@Bimmersport
10-14-2005, 10:29 PM
For "E46 LOVER"

HOLY FAWK! You are 18 years old and list your car as "another members car"

You post 10 times daily, and call yourself a post whore.

Get off your parents computer and go get a job kiddo!

hey dumbshit, i work at mississauga honda...and its my computer, i didnt change my ride thing cuz i dont come on here now. i got an E36 with OEM M3 kit (except rear/mirrors)..so STFU.

4 door have the same grills as 2 door for corresponding year, the 96+ sedans didnt have a narrow 92-95 style grill. no one made us experts and me or miguel (who i dont even talk to except in a post on here) called ourselfs one either, your just the dumbass who doesnt know shit about his own car.

Jon@Bimmersport
10-14-2005, 10:57 PM
another 1997 M3 luxo from kitchener Ont, this is 97M3/4's car

http://img79.exs.cx/img79/9734/newsigs2copy7gq.jpg

M-Power
10-14-2005, 10:59 PM
Hey man,
So you post pics of coupes and claim that they are all the same, in ALL TRIM LEVELS for all M3's including sedans.

I can't believe that you guys didn't freak out over the sides AND the rear spoiler not being the same as the coupe.

THEY ARE ALL DIFFERENT! Every body panel is different! Next thing you know you will say the cabriolet shares the same part number as a sedan!

E46 Lover. Nice E36 with M3 add ons. GOOD FOR YOU, Motorsport wanna-be!

Save your money and but a nice, original, rare, as delivered from BMW, never in a collision, all original (including the grill), M3 sedan, luxury package including some classy BMW enhancements.

M-Power
10-14-2005, 11:02 PM
Hey nice blurred pics. Thanks for your help post whore!

touchofclass
10-14-2005, 11:22 PM
That is an awesome M3 Best of luck with the sale :) Well worth the money :)

jeff328i
10-14-2005, 11:25 PM
still have my lights on it? good luck with the sale

M-Power
10-14-2005, 11:56 PM
Was the optional Luxury Package continued on North American 3.2-liter M3s?
Yes. The Luxury Package option of the 1995 North American M3 continued unchanged (with the exception of additional leather on the seatbacks) for the later 3.2-liter model, but only on those built before September, 1997 (1996 and 1997 model years). The package was discontinued starting with the 1998 model year (9/97 production), at which time the front armrest became standard equipment (already standard in Canada) and the M Contour II wheels were offered as a no-cost option.

The 1997 M3 Sedan is fitted with a more restrained M-Technic front airdam and front grill. Though similar to the one used on M3 coupes and convertibles, it contains three body-color horizontal slats in place of the mesh intake and (like the convertible) lacks the black plastic lower lip extension. Also, the side valance panels are less heavily sculpted.

(quoted from the net)

SickFinga
10-15-2005, 03:54 AM
Miguel,
Are you an expert on M3 4 door cars?



M-Power, I'm an expert on e36 m3 Sedans and I can tell you, YOU ARE WRONG.
You car has a grill from an older 92-96 e36.


Maybe Miguel is not an expert on e36 m3/4 but he sure knows more about it than you.

Jon@Bimmersport
10-15-2005, 07:45 AM
Hey man,
So you post pics of coupes and claim that they are all the same, in ALL TRIM LEVELS for all M3's including sedans.

I can't believe that you guys didn't freak out over the sides AND the rear spoiler not being the same as the coupe.

THEY ARE ALL DIFFERENT! Every body panel is different! Next thing you know you will say the cabriolet shares the same part number as a sedan!

E46 Lover. Nice E36 with M3 add ons. GOOD FOR YOU, Motorsport wanna-be!

Save your money and but a nice, original, rare, as delivered from BMW, never in a collision, all original (including the grill), M3 sedan, luxury package including some classy BMW enhancements.

your sides are diff because of the luxo package, thats why u have contours and the slits in your front bumper along with no M3 lip, the regular or "sport" M3 sedans have the twisting sideskirts, along with probably double spoke II M3 wheels and the regular or "2 door bumper" as you would probably say because your an idiot who doesnt know that the 2 door luxury M3s look the exact same as 4 door minus the 2 doors and vice versa.

Im saving up alrite, but not for an E36 M3 :rolleyes: esp with the stupid luxo package.

Just because the dimensions of a part are different, doesnt mean they dont share the same DESIGN. I never said they are the same, but BMW didnt change the grills for luxury packages sedans. Can you prove it?

Call me a motorsport wannabe, but in about 3 weeks ill be able to run circles around your almighty M3/4.....in the turns and in the straights.

Like you posted, the front airdam is refering to the bumper as a WHOLE, the front GRILL is the little slits u have instead of the mesh...where does it mention anyting about KIDNEY GRILLS as BMW refers ot them? Wait, i dont see it....oh yea thats cuz THEY DIDNT CHANGE THEM.

Miguel
10-15-2005, 11:42 AM
M-Power, I'm an expert on e36 m3 Sedans and I can tell you, YOU ARE WRONG.
You car has a grill from an older 92-96 e36.


Maybe Miguel is not an expert on e36 m3/4 but he sure knows more about it than you.
Don't worry about it. This guy is just upset that I pointed out that
THIS CAR WAS OBVIOUSLY IN AN ACCIDENT OF SOME SORT... PROBABLY A NICE HARD FRONT END COLLISSION...
unless he has some other explanation for being the ONLY 1997 BMW in existence with a factory 92-96 grill and nose panel.

Antz_Marchin
10-15-2005, 12:38 PM
^^^Wow, that's kinda brutal. I have known the of car for a long time as I live in St Catharines and granted that I am no expert...haha... on M3 sedan grills...and I have a measly 500 posts which I could bump up to 12,000 in the test forum in order to have a respected opinion. I know of no problems with the car, nor does the dealership from which it is routinely serviced (I have a friend there, oh yeah...and he's an expert in 1986 325e's but only the 2 door with sunroof and cloth interior...he's also working on becoming an expert in the field of E46 323i exhausts and fog lights ....he knows his stuff)

///eP
10-15-2005, 04:22 PM
e46_lover is right, i have a 95 m3 luxury (2door) and it looks identical to your four door, minus 2 doors of course, i have the same "non-twisting" side skirts my front bumper is the same with the 3 horizontal slits, but my bumper has the m lip on it and it came with the contours (except i dont have the contours dammit, but it is my spare in the trunk:). Now back to the infamous grilles, 97 and up have a different nose panel(and grilles) than the 92 -95 if you dont believe anyone here, go to the bmw dealership and ask them for a set of 97 sedan kidney grilles, i guarantee they will look nothing like yours. one thing i did notice, is that your car has the headlight washers on the nose panel, now i dont know but maybe bmw's with the headlight washer option on the nose panel still came with the older slim grilles, but thats a question for justin_e36 lol he knows everything.

1BADBMR
10-15-2005, 04:43 PM
Forget the damn grills.....There ain't no such thing as a 4 door M3 :rolleyes:

GOOD LUCK WITH THE SALE

hioctane
10-16-2005, 09:25 AM
Hehe, this thread is funny as hell. You guys can be a bit brutal; but he did start it. A simple reply to Miguels question would have been fine. The front grill is wrong period; research harder. free bump! :)

SickFinga
10-17-2005, 05:32 AM
now i dont know but maybe bmw's with the headlight washer option on the nose panel still came with the older slim grilles, but thats a question for justin_e36 lol he knows everything.


No they dont, winter packaged e36s (headlight washers is one of the options of the package) have the same grill

Manimillion
10-17-2005, 07:59 AM
I was going to say nice car, and good luck with the sale until I saw the debate about the front end. And before that, I was reading and you said you have no mods, but you have wheels on your car which are considered a mod to me...

I'll be an other member telling you the front end is a 92-96 front end.

http://webb.informatik.gu.se/~s03danee/skoj/owned-cat_jpg.jpg

lvan
10-17-2005, 08:31 AM
Mig and E46 trying to tell him nicely but it turns out opposite hehe .How can you not realize that you got an early model grill.


If anyone comes to see the car , that will be the first thing to ask. If you got no idea about, he will just walk off because he would not belif you are not aware of it.

1BADRIDE
10-17-2005, 08:42 AM
Post the VIN.

M-Power
10-17-2005, 04:33 PM
I have done the following to help clarify what the experts in this thread are commenting on. You can form your own opinion!

The car "build date" is 10/96.
A visit to the dealer revealed that 09/96 was the crossover point between the model years. As it was probably started in 09/96, it may very well be a 1996 grill. It IS a different part than what is typically on a 1997.
There are different opinions about this, with people stating 92-95 parts are the same, and 97 on. Was 1996 the grey area between the most obvious changes? The dealer states it was, and the car was probably an "end of the line" car that received the previous nose. It is not uncommon for late build date cars or even early build date cars have parts from corresponding years depending on where they were on the line, ACCORDING TO THE DEALER. Please, don't shoot the messenger. I asked them BECAUSE I DIDN"T KNOW. Guilty as charged!

The car was originally registered in mid 1997, with one owner until 2004, at which time we bought the car.(AFTER a pre-purchase inspection that verified there is NO COLLISION DAMAGE.) I have the UVIP package that shows the obvious, NO BRANDING, no odometer rollback etc..

To go one step further, I purchased a complete Canadian and American car history through the Carproof website. It is like Carfax, but they search all over North America. I would post the link but it contains way too much personal information. Here is the Ontario finding which is the one and only place it has ever been registered. Any insurance claims for collision damage would be shown in the search.

Ontario Ministry of Transportation
1201 Wilson Ave., Downsview, ON M3M 1J8
Registered In This Jurisdiction As:


Record Found: Yes

Stolen: No

Salvage: No

Non-Repairable: No

Rebuilt: No

Unfit: No

Abandoned: No

Moved: No

Sold: No

Incorrect Vin: No

This Vehicle has been registered as Normal in this jurisdiction. Vehicle is registered and currently has no abnormal statuses

FURTHER TO THAT

Date: 10/17/2005
Time: 15:59 hrs
Canadian Vehicle Summary
United States Vehicle Summary

Registration Records Registration Records Found No Records Found
Vehicle Status Normal No Problems Found
Lien Records Lien Record Found No Lien Records Found
Odometer Readings No Odometer Records Found No Odometer Records Found
3rd Party History No Records Found No Records Found
Insurance History No Record Found Not Available
Data Reporting All Data Sources Reporting

Note the line INSURANCE HISTORY - NO RECORD FOUND

With the due diligence of insurance companies these days, I think that finding is the most significant.

SO ATTENTION ALL EXPERTS, NAY SAYERS, AND ALL AROUND PIKES IN THE WEEDS LURKING OUT THERE, FORM YOUR OWN OPINION!

In closing, I should apologize to all that I insulted, because it was entirely inappropriate.
And thanks to the members that supported me, in varying degrees of kindness!

////M

p.s. Of course, the original documentation will be provided to those who are interested in purchasing a very nice M3!

SickFinga
10-17-2005, 08:37 PM
I have done the following to help clarify what the experts in this thread are commenting on. You can form your own opinion!

The car "build date" is 10/96.
A visit to the dealer revealed that 09/96 was the crossover point between the model years. As it was probably started in 09/96, it may very well be a 1996 grill. It IS a different part than what is typically on a 1997.
There are different opinions about this, with people stating 92-95 parts are the same, and 97 on. Was 1996 the grey area between the most obvious changes? The dealer states it was, and the car was probably an "end of the line" car that received the previous nose. It is not uncommon for late build date cars or even early build date cars have parts from corresponding years depending on where they were on the line, ACCORDING TO THE DEALER. Please, don't shoot the messenger. I asked them BECAUSE I DIDN"T KNOW. Guilty as charged!


My M3/4 is also 96(dont remember the month), but it is registred as 97 and I got 97 style grill.


M3 Sedan was an all new car in North America. First built date for m3 sedan was 09/96, but it was sold as a 97 car. For that reason there were no M3 Sedans sold in North America with 96 style grill. There was no gray area for them.

M-Power
10-17-2005, 09:37 PM
Well why don't you go to BMW and get the build sheet for your car? It will tell you when it was built.
The M3/4 was indeed new for North America for 1997, and you are in agreement with the dealer that 09/96 was the crossover for the model years.
However your theory of no gray area or parts being mixed between them conflicts with what a very experienced BMW parts man (20 years experience) and Master Technician (25 years experience in Britain and N.A.) are telling as the truth. It in fact is something they have routinely discovered with the E36 cars.
I have nothing else to reflect upon the issue.

Wannabe
10-17-2005, 10:23 PM
Good luck with the sale......!!

I do find it funny how some worker over in germany 9 years ago probably wasn't caring(I am sorry, BMW's are built wirh care :) ) and put in an old grill.. and its causing all these problems today!!! its weird how one mistake someone made years ago can cause all these problems today!

ScotcH
10-18-2005, 12:16 AM
Good luck with the sale......!!

I do find it funny how some worker over in germany 9 years ago probably wasn't caring(I am sorry, BMW's are built wirh care :) ) and put in an old grill.. and its causing all these problems today!!! its weird how one mistake someone made years ago can cause all these problems today!

Well, it's equelly as likely that the previous owner simple swapped it after a minor hit that was not reported to the insurance company. Not saying that's the case, just that it is possible (and probably more likely than some german dude being drunk on the assembly line *drink* )

In either case, it's a great car I'm sure, and really it's just some grills ... not the freakin' motor!

SickFinga
10-18-2005, 01:31 PM
Well why don't you go to BMW and get the build sheet for your car? It will tell you when it was built.
The M3/4 was indeed new for North America for 1997, and you are in agreement with the dealer that 09/96 was the crossover for the model years.
However your theory of no gray area or parts being mixed between them conflicts with what a very experienced BMW parts man (20 years experience) and Master Technician (25 years experience in Britain and N.A.) are telling as the truth. It in fact is something they have routinely discovered with the E36 cars.
I have nothing else to reflect upon the issue.


I'm glad that they got 45 years of combined exeprience, but like you said before, they've never seen a 4 door M3 before yours. That says it all.

Seriously, I went to BMW Missasauga three times in the past week. Every time I had to show them where a part I needed located. Every time, they asked me if its a real M3 or not.

I dont have 20 years of experience, but I wouldnt have to ask a question like that when a car in question is right infront of me.


P.S. ScotcH, is tha ACS lip?

Miguel
10-18-2005, 03:20 PM
I'm glad that they got 45 years of combined exeprience, but like you said before, they've never seen a 4 door M3 before yours. That says it all.

Seriously, I went to BMW Missasauga three times in the past week. Every time I had to show them where a part I needed located. Every time, they asked me if its a real M3 or not.

I dont have 20 years of experience, but I wouldnt have to ask a question like that when a car in question is right infront of me.


P.S. ScotcH, is tha ACS lip?
I agree with you on the years of experience part lol. If it's not a 2Dr. M3 then it just doesnt exist ROFL!! heaven help em if an LTW rolled in.

I think that a maxvelocity RS lip or something similar... but hell, what do I know?? :confused:
http://www.maxvelocity.net/e36lip/rs_lip1.jpg
http://www.maxvelocity.net/e36lip/rs_lip3.jpg

M-Power
10-18-2005, 04:07 PM
Well guys, I just want to say thanks. It is nice to see opinions expressed in such a frank and forthright manner.
I was nonplussed at first, until I was able to garnish some professional opinions and BMW documentation (ie. the build sheet) along with a Carproof document.
As far as commenting on the years of experience of the BMW employees, well they see E36 cars every day. Why make fun of them? They are great guys and are very helpful! Just because M3 sedans aren't the norm, who cares! This isn't Europe either, but the BMW tech did work there before he came to Canada. I am sure he's worked on some nice cars there. Actually there was that M1 he rebuilt but that's another story.....
I called the dealers that are stamped in the service book, and neither state that the car was ever noted for anything except for regular maintenance.
With my own p.p.i. and the opinions I have found, I give credibility to those that have actually seen my car, and worked on it.

And also thanks for the repeated bumps to the top of the forum! I am beating the modded 328is in views!!!!!!!!!!!! *th-up*

////M

razor/m5
10-18-2005, 05:03 PM
Have you ever thought that maybe the previous owner smacked his car and decided to fix it himself instead of going through insurance ? because if thats the case no car fax or anything else for that matter will tell you besides a body shop

Ital_325i
10-18-2005, 06:01 PM
Well, it's equelly as likely that the previous owner simple swapped it after a minor hit that was not reported to the insurance company. Not saying that's the case, just that it is possible (and probably more likely than some german dude being drunk on the assembly line *drink* )

In either case, it's a great car I'm sure, and really it's just some grills ... not the freakin' motor!

I agree

Not to beat the dead horse, but why would they put the old style kidneys, and the new style side markers?

ScotcH
10-18-2005, 11:59 PM
I think that a maxvelocity RS lip or something similar... but hell, what do I know?? :confused:


Close ... it's actually a maxvelocity HardCore track splitter. It's a complete undertray that replaces the OE undertray. It is also now in many pieces after Saturday's 4x4 excursion :(

Mitch Fong
10-19-2005, 01:48 PM
i cant believe i just read all of that.. To bad i cannot input as i kno wnothing of the m3/4 let alone the 4 door apsect.