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View Full Version : What handles better? F1 or LMR?


M3ti Compact
05-14-2002, 10:20 PM
There is a huge disagreement going on...what do you think?

Which handles better? The BMW Williams F1, or the BMW LMR?

I think that the LMR would handle better because it is closed wheel and the whole body acts as a spoiler- resulting in more downforce for turning. Not to mention that it does have external spoilers as well.

My friend thinks that F1 is F1 therefore it is the fastest, and can outhandle the LMR. The spoilers on the F1 put out more downforce than the LMR's spoilers can.

http://www.msport-uk.com/photo/goodwoodfos01/bmw_v12_lmr.jpg
this one

http://www.dailyf1.com/data/photos/2001/teams/williams-car.jpg
or this one???

'88 325e
05-14-2002, 10:43 PM
I would have to say the Williams BMW F1 for shure! 800hp and light as a feather. The aero package on the F1 cars is amazing! I bet if they could go fast enough they could drive upside down.

Mr seville
05-14-2002, 11:28 PM
mmmmmm thats a tuffy gonna hafta take it to the track i think if you call bmw(germany) they'll tell you*wave*

shrigzz
05-15-2002, 12:20 AM
I'd put my money on the Williams F1.

Furious
05-15-2002, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by '88 325e
I would have to say the Williams BMW F1 for shure! 800hp and light as a feather. The aero package on the F1 cars is amazing! I bet if they could go fast enough they could drive upside down.


ladies and gents that quote is what i like to call "words from out my damn mouth"....and yes there is enough downforce on F1 cars to theoritically drive upside down,,i saw a segment on speedvision........

vodomagoo
05-15-2002, 02:34 AM
hemm now bring the mclaren f1 into this, it is engineered as a f1 car then a body was put onto it. when i saw it up on a lift for the 1st time i was breathless:D the car is art*love* and it is a f1 with a body and can ahve a roll cage so hemm gets me thinking

E30 Stu
05-15-2002, 10:52 AM
First off, F1 cars, and LMP cars are BEYOND roll cages guys.. they have Carbon Monocoque chassis' that are 100 times stiffer than any steel unit-body :rolleyes: they don't need roll cages.

And, lots of cars could "drive upside down" with the amount of downforce modern sports car create. The Audi R8 LMP car can "drive upside down" at only 100mph! So could every other LMP car, F1 car, etc.

Bottom line is, F1 cars weigh like 1400lbs and LMP cars weigh 2000lbs. So, the F1 car is more agile.. but LMP cars run full bodywork, full slicks, much larger brakes, they're wider, and have more wheelbase. I would guess the LMP car "handles" better despite the fact the F1 car probaby is still faster..

djcontra
05-16-2002, 09:44 AM
the LMP car will handle much better than an F1 car.
F1 is much faster though.
I've seen alot more spinouts in an F1 car than an LMP car.

got torque?
05-16-2002, 12:03 PM
What exactly does the number of "spinouts" you've seen have to do with which car handles better?

NeeDiT
05-16-2002, 01:03 PM
i would think F1 cars will handle better (enter and exit turns the fastest, generating more Gs). F1 cars are the best we can put on a track and they have evolved tru the years to be what they are today. if a differnet design was going to give them better handling, believe me, it would have been on the track by now...

Furious
05-16-2002, 04:04 PM
ok now the next question is who has the better and bigger tires,, that will definately give a suspension advantage,, BTW- i still put my money on the f1

Alex Mc
05-18-2002, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by NeeDiT
i would think F1 cars will handle better (enter and exit turns the fastest, generating more Gs). F1 cars are the best we can put on a track and they have evolved tru the years to be what they are today. if a differnet design was going to give them better handling, believe me, it would have been on the track by now...

Wrong, F1 cars are built to STRINGENT specs, almost any handling/performance increasing device is outlawed by the next race. F1 is the pinnacle of technology, but only within what FIA allows, which isn't much. Although an F1 car is FASTER, it still has much less grip than an LMP car due to it's narrower, grooved tires, high drag coefficient, and less surface area to create efficient downforce.

The Audi R8R LMP car has 370mm width rear tires, 330mm fronts, which is MUCH larger than F1 cars, plus they are full slicks not grooved.

M3Pilot
05-20-2002, 06:03 PM
So what are we actually talking here?
Feel? Or put one againt the other round a track?
An F1 car can drive upside down at speed no worries.

It can create nearly 5 g round the bends I bet a LMR is no were near that level of grip and nearly as much when braking too.

An F1 car would leave the LMR, it is the top of the tree as far as Motorsport is concerned.

I have see both car racing, and believe me when you see an F1 car go through something like Eau Rouge at Spa or the
Craner Curse at Donnington part and see how that car can change direction, and just how fast in can go round such bends you would have no doubt either.

Nice pics by the way taken at the Goodwood Festival of Speed which I will be going to in about 6 weeks time :):):)

Alex Mc
05-20-2002, 06:07 PM
Well there's no doubt the F1 car is FASTER, but all i'm saying is that i'd probably enjoy lapping in a BMW LMR as opposed to a BMW F1 car. I know the F1 car is faster..

And soooo many cars create their car's weight in downforce, which theoritically would allow them to drive upside down, but it's never been done. It's just cool to say it.

The Audi R8 could drive upside down at only 100mph!

M3Pilot
05-20-2002, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by Alex Mc
Well there's no doubt the F1 car is FASTER, but all i'm saying is that i'd probably enjoy lapping in a BMW LMR as opposed to a BMW F1 car. I know the F1 car is faster..

And soooo many cars create their car's weight in downforce, which theoritically would allow them to drive upside down, but it's never been done. It's just cool to say it.

The Audi R8 could drive upside down at only 100mph!

The LMR may be more fun to drive, but the question was which handles better, and I would say the F1.

I can't think of anything that would touch an F1 car for handling, Cart or IRL weight about twice as much and the brakes are no where near as good. GT car neither.
Just think how quick one could be if the didn't have all the regulation that the FIA put on them, it would be unbelieveable :)

NeeDiT
05-21-2002, 02:40 AM
i think superbikes get the closeset to lap times of an F1 car - i mean lap time for the same track...

M3Pilot
05-21-2002, 04:09 PM
Originally posted by NeeDiT
i think superbikes get the closeset to lap times of an F1 car - i mean lap time for the same track...


I don't think a Superbike would keep up with the F1 car on the striaghts and never in the bends.

I've got a Jerermy Clarkson video where they race a
Porsche Carrera 4 against a Yamaha R1.

The car was driven by the 2001 BTCC champion Jason Plato and the bike was driven by the 3 times British Superbike champion
Niall Mckenzine, so theses guy know what there doing.

The race was 1 lap of the Thruxton race circuit.
The Porsche was 3/4 of a second quicker round the lap, it wasn't quicker on the striaghts but the grip that is generated by the 4 big tyres on the car around the bends makes all the difference.

So as to a superbike against an F1 can I don't think it would stand a chance round the bends and would still lose on the striaghts too :)

Furious
05-21-2002, 04:30 PM
i think im with you on that one pilot,,a super bike could probably take an F1 on a rather straight track, but anything that wasnt straight, would be a lost cause..........BTW- nice to see your still around.

M3Pilot
05-22-2002, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by Furious325is
i think im with you on that one pilot,,a super bike could probably take an F1 on a rather straight track, but anything that wasnt straight, would be a lost cause..........BTW- nice to see your still around.

I don';t think the bike could take it on the striaght either.
Whats the 0-60 on a bike like that 3 secs?
I would have thought that the F1 car was at least the quick and them some.
If you think that Mclaren F1 can do it in 3.2 sec, the F1 is lighter and more powerful :)

I'm still here lurking around, just don't seem to post that much as I tend to post on too many forums these days amd don't get the time, Plus I like to try and hany with the E30 guys, but when the need takes me I still do :)