PDA

View Full Version : E46 M3 vs. E36 M3 vs. Eurospec M3


UncleJ
01-31-2004, 10:53 PM
In 6 months, I am trading in my 328i one of the 3 cars in the title.

However, there are a few specifications regarding each choice.

For the E46 M3, it would be a 3 year lease that my dad would pay and then I would pay off the buyout at the end of it. Now, I don't know to much about leases, so I don't know how much a buyout would cost me. In a lease, is atleast half of the car payed off?

For the E36 M3, my dad would pay for all of it. I looked at one yesterday and I love it so much. The interior is awsome and the exterior is amazing as well. However, the car would have to have very low KM, no more than 45k.

For the Eurospec M3, well... I don't know too much about it. I do know it has 321 horsepower, but any other major differences. Also, I havn't seen many for sale, so what would the chances be of me finding one with no more than 45k on it. How much do they go for anyway?

I'd appreciate all of your opinions and any websites on these cars would help as well.

UncleJ
01-31-2004, 10:56 PM
Oh, dammit I forgot to add what I want in a car.

I'm afraid the E46 will have too many gizmos in it and I want a dirver's car. I don't want the car too feel like the car is doing most of the work. I like the E36 M3 alot, the interior hugs you and everything is directed towards the driver. I'm pretty much leaning toward the E36 M3.

Jon@Bimmersport
01-31-2004, 11:18 PM
eurospec has 286hp...not 321hp. do u know how much maintance and attention the eurospec engine requires? just get the US spec. or the E46 M3 after u find out the buy out...

if u want a drivers car...get an E30 M3.

UncleJ
01-31-2004, 11:40 PM
Originally posted by E46_lover
eurospec has 286hp...not 321hp. do u know how much maintance and attention the eurospec engine requires? just get the US spec. or the E46 M3 after u find out the buy out...

if u want a drivers car...get an E30 M3.

E30 looks too dated and I don't want that much of a driver's car.

Jon@Bimmersport
01-31-2004, 11:42 PM
oh, i forgot to add...E46 M3 is still a drivers car...its not like u floor it and turn the wheel and it corrects ur driving, u can turn ASC/DSC off u know...and the E46 is more than u can handle when its off..trust me. even E36 M3 is more than most ppl can handle if they pushed it...at a driving skool that is.

e24_635csi
02-01-2004, 12:42 AM
Originally posted by UncleJ
E30 looks too dated and I don't want that much of a driver's car.


:eek: what are you talkin about looks too dated... the E30 M3 probally has one of the best body styles BMW has ever made, that 4 banger in there is one hell of a motor... not by far would i say its too dated... but thats just me, i love the classics.

I think you should go with just a regualr US spec E36 M3, the REAL euro E36 M3's from europe had 321hp - the 286hp was just the North American version Euro - Dont quote me on that, I may very well be mistaken.

M3NTALM3
02-01-2004, 02:10 AM
i don't think there should even be a discussion here! E46 M3 dominates the other cars in EVERY Category...whether u want a drivers car, a nice looking car, a fast car, etc etc... e46 m3 is just the best... and ur right jon, with traction off it's too much for MOSTTTT ppl to handle ;)

MorningCruiser
02-01-2004, 02:15 AM
I would only accept an E46 M3 if you gave me one. I think they're junk for the price. Go E36 M3 or true Euro M3.

Simby
02-01-2004, 02:43 AM
If money is not an issue, I would definitely get the E46 M3. I like that body the best. Plus it's newer. Doesn't it have the most power out of the 3 too?

Furious
02-01-2004, 02:51 AM
Originally posted by E46_lover
eurospec has 286hp...not 321hp. do u know how much maintance and attention the eurospec engine requires? just get the US spec. or the E46 M3 after u find out the buy out...

if u want a drivers car...get an E30 M3.

the real , real eurospec is 321, we got the 286 one in N.america

golden
02-01-2004, 03:22 AM
there was a euro spec e36 m3 in 1994 i think that was 286, the rest of the e36 m3 in north america were 240 hp

e46 = 333hp...

in terms of performance, e46 is the best.. looks? subjective

hey man, if your dad is buying it for you, go for the e46 m3

BladeRunner
02-01-2004, 04:12 AM
Lease sounds scary, how much driving do you do a year or a month? If you live in the city or if your a true drive and love taking your car on road trips the e46 may be bad. no don't quote me on that never had any experience with a lease but i know there are limits to milage per year.

The e46 may look hot now but wait until 100 more people get it then it'll be just like the MINI or the PT Cruiser...any old car on the road but with +/-333hp and a BMW badge :).

the e36 love them but it would most likely be hard to find one with less than 45k. remimber BMW (m3) is the Ultimate Drive Machine. BMWs love to be driven and drives love to drive their BMWs.

I believe the euro e36 M3 motor has many problems. one i think was cracking or blowing up. maintence might be a problem too, since parts would prob. be shipped...and how many people know euro e36 m3?

i beleive the e30's s14 motor is exspensive to work on too, and requires more checkups than the e36 m3.


I'm farely new to BMWs, especially the M3 so someone correct any of my erroneous statements at will.

fabianyee
02-01-2004, 04:51 AM
Originally posted by e24_635csi

I think you should go with just a regualr US spec E36 M3, the REAL euro E36 M3's from europe had 321hp - the 286hp was just the North American version Euro - Dont quote me on that, I may very well be mistaken.

EURO E36 M3 - 286bhp (3.0)
EURO E36 M3 EVO - 321 bhp (3.2)

SickFinga
02-01-2004, 05:06 AM
92-95 EURO M3 were 286hp
96-98 EURO M3 were 321hp

we got 94 m3s in cada, so they were 286.

I would stay away from lease, cause it is still NOT your car.
so you only choices are 94 EURO M3 or 95-99 US spec m3.

Jon@Bimmersport
02-01-2004, 05:30 AM
Originally posted by SickFinga
92-95 EURO M3 were 286hp
96-98 EURO M3 were 321hp

we got 94 m3s in cada, so they were 286.

I would stay away from lease, cause it is still NOT your car.
so you only choices are 94 EURO M3 or 95-99 US spec m3.

ya wat he said...

but seriously, do u knnow how much more euro M3 parts are? research more than whats more power...think about reliability..wat if u blow that euro M3 motor?

UncleJ
02-01-2004, 05:58 AM
Originally posted by E46_lover
ya wat he said...

but seriously, do u knnow how much more euro M3 parts are? research more than whats more power...think about reliability..wat if u blow that euro M3 motor?

That's why I'm asking. I have 6 months to decide.

R_JAY
02-01-2004, 06:33 AM
I'd say go for an E36 M3. That way it's paid for and you can mod it*th-up*

Jon@Bimmersport
02-01-2004, 06:35 AM
Originally posted by UncleJ
That's why I'm asking. I have 6 months to decide.

PM bimmersport, i had a completely different opinion on euro M3's after he told me wat he has to do for his...also ask randy about his dads eurospec (#1 of 45 too)

SUPERCHARGED
02-01-2004, 09:00 AM
If i where you i would get an E36 m3 and mod it.

If i had money for an E46 m3 i would get an E36 and put the rest of the money to MOD's. that would give you a way better car then an E46 M3.

Justin e36
02-01-2004, 01:07 PM
I'd go with the Euro M3... if I could afford it. Yeah it's more expensive... but it's more than the engine, you get a completely Euro car... rear fog lights, ZKW ellipsoids with candlelights... and all those other european bell's and whistle's that I wish came w/ my E36.

The fundamental differences is that our US M3's are basically 328i engines with extra boring to make it 3.0 (or 3.2) liter. Euro M3's are hand-made I6's. Primary differences lying in the more sophisticated cylinder head, intake, and engine management... there is also differences in the suspension, transmission, and it's 11.3 compression...

And hey.. you live in Mississauga and Bimmersport (mentioned earlier) has a Euro Spec M3... also in 'Sauga---and he happens to be a mechanic too. So you have someone in your backyard who already knows how to work on these puppies with repairs and all.

Otherwise I'd go with a E46 M3 (drop top if possible). Yes you won't be able to mod it right away... but you really don't need to. Beside the money you'll be saving from maintenance over the next 3 years is considerable. E36's are getting to that age where problems are starting to arise. Besides that, you are also looking at a much higher return value on your car 5-6 years down the line.

My two cents.
J

.. btw, I have a couple engine pics of EuroSpec M3's if you care to see 'em.

EMPOWERD
02-01-2004, 06:09 PM
i'd get the U.S E36 M3 and slap a blower on it. reliable, fast, cheaper to repair, sleeper quotient and lower insurance costs. I've driven all of them, and that's the most fun.

UncleJ
02-01-2004, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by Justin e36
I'd go with the Euro M3... if I could afford it. Yeah it's more expensive... but it's more than the engine, you get a completely Euro car... rear fog lights, ZKW ellipsoids with candlelights... and all those other european bell's and whistle's that I wish came w/ my E36.

The fundamental differences is that our US M3's are basically 328i engines with extra boring to make it 3.0 (or 3.2) liter. Euro M3's are hand-made I6's. Primary differences lying in the more sophisticated cylinder head, intake, and engine management... there is also differences in the suspension, transmission, and it's 11.3 compression...

And hey.. you live in Mississauga and Bimmersport (mentioned earlier) has a Euro Spec M3... also in 'Sauga---and he happens to be a mechanic too. So you have someone in your backyard who already knows how to work on these puppies with repairs and all.

Otherwise I'd go with a E46 M3 (drop top if possible). Yes you won't be able to mod it right away... but you really don't need to. Beside the money you'll be saving from maintenance over the next 3 years is considerable. E36's are getting to that age where problems are starting to arise. Besides that, you are also looking at a much higher return value on your car 5-6 years down the line.

My two cents.
J

.. btw, I have a couple engine pics of EuroSpec M3's if you care to see 'em.

Sure, post some pics.

UncleJ
02-01-2004, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by R_JAY
I'd say go for an E36 M3. That way it's paid for and you can mod it*th-up*

That's another plus, I'd own it without anymore payments.

Mystikal
02-01-2004, 07:27 PM
Originally posted by EMPOWERD
i'd get the U.S E36 M3 and slap a blower on it. reliable, fast, cheaper to repair, sleeper quotient and lower insurance costs. I've driven all of them, and that's the most fun.

What he said.

Gianpaolo_E46
02-01-2004, 09:31 PM
why not look into an M coupe?

UncleJ
02-01-2004, 10:51 PM
Originally posted by T_DOT_BIMMER
why not look into an M coupe?

I need backseats just in case.

Jammasterj
02-02-2004, 06:43 AM
First off, anyone that says the E46 M3 is not a drivers car has clearly never driven one.

Its true though with the E46 you will save lots of $$ in repairs and normal maintence with bmw's $100 per hour std rate which you won't have to worry about with a new car.

Now if you lease the car, from BMW for example you will be paying higher than prime rates which will cost you $$ in interest payments alone and the buy back will be quite a bit of money. You will never get a deal from BMW unless they have to move the car on the odd occasion.

The eurospec is a good car but it may be hard to find one, especially one that is in good condition and has not had the sh*t beaten out of it. It may be hard to find the parts for one as well, bmw won't stock them and they will need to be ordered which will again cost you $$.

Either way you are looking to spend big bucks, my suggestion is go for the E46, wait save up and put a few bucks onto it. It is one GOOD looking car

crazyvadim
02-02-2004, 08:22 AM
Whatever you do,dont lease!I made a big mistake by leasing my BMW,it feels like im renting the damn car

Justin e36
02-02-2004, 10:26 AM
hey no problem vadim... I'll continue your payments, and you can have my E36.. :D

sonny
02-02-2004, 03:42 PM
E46 M3

97 Z3 2.8
02-02-2004, 08:27 PM
If you lease, milage is usually restricted to 24K per year. Buyout after 36 mos is usually 50 to 55% of the original Cap cost (price of car). Assume 52%. BMW often offers discounted finance rates on used cars to get them out of their dealers shops. Sometimes rate wise it's better to pick up a demo 03 than a new 04. Although rates are generally competitice with the banks give or take a point, BMW doesn't discount rates or prices heavily.

You will have a difficult time finding an NA E36 M3 with 45K or less on the clock. Expect to pay 32 to 35K. No warranties.

Problem area's are air pumps, O2 sensors, cats and ball joints. Also check rear trailing arm bushings and subframe mounting points. If the mounting points are cracked walk away, this car has been abused.

For an Evo E36. The only year you'll find is 94. To get 45K or under expect to pay about the same, give or take a few grand. More reasonalby you could get one with 100K that is in good shape.

Engines are rock solid reliable as long as you get the valves adjusted (with shims) regualrly (every 15K I believe, but I could be wrong). The E46 requires similar adjustment but will be covered under maintenance.

E36 uses hydraulic lifters which do not require maitenance.
Parts for Evo M3's are significantly more, $300 for an intake valve, but as with any BMW if you can't afford to do the proper upkeep you should likely look for a good Honda, as they'll take the abuse.

The comment above about the 92 to 95 euro being 286hp is correct. OBD II cars experienced a sizable HP gain.

Jon@Bimmersport
02-02-2004, 08:54 PM
there was no 92-95 euro M3..there was 94-95 with 3.0L 286hp and 5spd tranny, which we got here. and the EVO M3 is from 96-99 which is 3.2L 321hp with a 6speed tranny or SMG1 tranny, we never got any EVO's over here...unfortunately.

97 Z3 2.8
02-02-2004, 10:03 PM
Whichever, you get what I was tring to say....that's all I'm worried about.

Tell Randy Bill & Chris say hi!
Thanks.

j23chan
02-02-2004, 10:28 PM
here's a link to the diffs between euro and US
http://www.bcw3design.com/m3/us_euro_faq.htm

moerom
02-03-2004, 06:03 AM
Dinan Supercharger to an E36 M3 (U.S. Spec), gives roughly 300 at the wheels, good for a low 13 at 108+ mph. 2 year warranty, rock solid reliability (but you can't run ZKW's with a Dinan setup lol)..

plus, the looks of THE SEXIEST body style ever... the e36!

SickFinga
02-03-2004, 06:10 AM
Originally posted by E46_lover
there was no 92-95 euro M3..there was 94-95 with 3.0L 286hp and 5spd tranny, which we got here. and the EVO M3 is from 96-99 which is 3.2L 321hp with a 6speed tranny or SMG1 tranny, we never got any EVO's over here...unfortunately.

In europe e36 m3 came out in 93

moerom
02-03-2004, 06:58 AM
But as a 94 model year though right?

328is_Perf
02-03-2004, 11:03 PM
E36 M3 is extremely modifyable .... the Euro M3 is 321 hp (i think its different from this eurospec youre talking about)

Mystikal
02-04-2004, 12:11 AM
Originally posted by 328is_Perf
the Euro M3 is 321 hp (i think its different from this eurospec youre talking about)

No, that is the Evolution model. The standard one was still 286hp.

Jon@Bimmersport
02-04-2004, 12:43 AM
jesus we repeated the same damn thing over and over...

GUYS THESE ARE THE FACTS

94-95 (or 93-95..sickfinga) euro M3 is 286hp 3.0L
96-99 euro M3 is the EVO M3 321hp 3.2L

SpudBoy
02-04-2004, 12:57 AM
Originally posted by E46_lover
jesus we repeated the same damn thing over and over...

GUYS THESE ARE THE FACTS

94-95 (or 93-95..sickfinga) euro M3 is 286hp 3.0L
96-99 euro M3 is the EVO M3 321hp 3.2L

Euro's are not designed for North American gas.

Jon@Bimmersport
02-04-2004, 01:04 AM
if im not mistaken, the japanese gas level 98 octane is the equivalent of 94 here...thats what i read somewhere, im guessing it is the same for europe? because why would peoples eurospec M3's still be lasting?

Mystikal
02-04-2004, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by E46_lover
if im not mistaken, the japanese gas level 98 octane is the equivalent of 94 here...thats what i read somewhere, im guessing it is the same for europe? because why would peoples eurospec M3's still be lasting?

True, it's the AKI vs. RON scales.

SpudBoy
02-04-2004, 02:00 AM
North American Lead
(as in non-leaded)
true fact