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View Full Version : Understeer/Oversteer issues.


Autotechnica
08-13-2003, 03:00 PM
This only applies to people who push their cars hard in the corners. I've been experiencing some odd hanlding from my E36. When I push the car into a curvey 90 degree bend I turn the steering wheel slightly then full throttle in 2nd gear about 50-60km/h. The front end will run wide at first and I get understeer, then all of a sudden I will get oversteer, then opposite lock, etc. The problem with that is, when I try to powerslide, understeer, then oversteer will put me right into a curb. Is this normal on E36? A friend of mine with an M3 seems to experience the same problems, but since the front control arms bushings on the M3 increase the wheel base I think M3's are prone to more understeer than the rest of the E36's.

I've tried this many many times and each time the same thing happens. I'm thinking it may be related to the tires and when the sidewalls finally give out the rear end comes around. Just tell me this is normal and I'll be satisfied. That is till I find a way to get rid of all that icky understeer. And I don't have enough torque to adjust the angle of the car w/ the throttle, and I don't want to try using lift off oversteer since you have to build up quite a bit of speed to do that.

Some people may think this is pretty useless. But trust me, you should pratice this everytime you get the chance in a safe place. It actually improves your driving skill a great deal. In the past when I slide or the rear end comes around I freak out and yell "I'm going to die I'm going to die!" (- Jeremy Clarkson), but now I can counter the situation much better by knowing the car's limits and how it reacts to certain things.

Thanks guys!

Bryan

Soldo
08-13-2003, 05:01 PM
Just keep messing around with the suspension components on your car, stuff like tire pressure, shocks (if you can), sways, stuff like that will do surprising things with the whole oversteer/understeer issue!

Autotechnica
08-13-2003, 08:53 PM
Thanks, I'm hoping some stiffer sway bars will correct the problem. Just need to save up :)

Bry

AzN_E46
08-16-2003, 06:53 PM
take out the front swaybar if you really like oversteer *drink* :D :D ;);)

Autotechnica
08-16-2003, 10:36 PM
Originally posted by AzN_E46
take out the front swaybar if you really like oversteer *drink* :D :D ;);)

That's the most intelligent thing I've ever read :huh?: :D

Bry

AzN_E46
08-17-2003, 05:29 AM
just jokez....but i think it'll be alot of fun in a parking lot....:D :D

e30-323ti
08-17-2003, 09:04 PM
Or put a fatter sway bar in the rear to help reduce understeer.

I had a 323GTX and it understeered heaps, I put a nice big swaybar on the back and it made a huge difference.
It turned in so much quicker and made the car feel alot more neutral, obviously that made it alot easier to provoke oversteer but you could determine how much oversteer was induced rather than packing yourself when the backend suddenly tries to over take the front.
Definitley a good way to get a lower powered car to respond to throttle steering.

sorry about the novel guys, just got carried away.

SpudBoy
08-17-2003, 10:05 PM
The tire width offset on my car causes serious understeer.

BMW's are now "engineered by lawyers" so that we don't sue BMWNA if the back end comes around. For some reason that's considered a liability by some US lawyers.

All I have done to aleviate the problem is slightly increase rear tire preasure and turned off traction control. This helps a lot but the car is still not neutral (tends to understeer a little but not as much). I'm looking at mods to fine tune the car.

Autotechnica
08-18-2003, 03:28 PM
Thanks for the info guys.

Anyone here just put in a rear E36M3 sway bar into their non-M3 E36? What were the results?

Thanks,

Bryan

Autotechnica
08-18-2003, 03:32 PM
Originally posted by SpudBoy
The tire width offset on my car causes serious understeer.

BMW's are now "engineered by lawyers" so that we don't sue BMWNA if the back end comes around. For some reason that's considered a liability by some US lawyers.

All I have done to aleviate the problem is slightly increase rear tire preasure and turned off traction control. This helps a lot but the car is still not neutral (tends to understeer a little but not as much). I'm looking at mods to fine tune the car.

I would have thought with all that power you could oversteer the car anytime just by using the throttle. I'm surprized your car still understeers. M Coupe is known as one of the best handling BMW's and most fun for power sliding. I could be wrong?

I didn't know BMWNA made the car's understeer purposely for safety reasons. I found the E30's to be much more tail happy. I recently test drove the 330ci and ripped the hell out of it. Nothing but understeer. I tried everything but the tail would not kick out. The T/C was off as well. Maybe something more powerful will help :)

It's still nice to know you can fine tune your car to make it oversteer more. I would kill myself if I drove a FWD *uzi* j/k

Bry

Furious
08-19-2003, 02:44 AM
hey bryan , knowing how you like to drive your car have you checked what the "toe' is on your car right now? mine has been experiencing nearly the same thing as you, and it turns out my car is toeing in 5 points where its suppose to only be 1/2 - 1 point in, ( i believe all BMW's are suppose to be toeing in just slightly, only 4wd cars are suppose to be perfectly straight [something i heard at mosport]) check to see if your car is toeing at all, its a very often overlooked issue,

Autotechnica
08-19-2003, 02:50 AM
Originally posted by Furious325is
hey bryan , knowing how you like to drive your car have you checked what the "toe' is on your car right now? mine has been experiencing nearly the same thing as you, and it turns out my car is toeing in 5 points where its suppose to only be 1/2 - 1 point in, ( i believe all BMW's are suppose to be toeing in just slightly, only 4wd cars are suppose to be perfectly straight [something i heard at mosport]) check to see if your car is toeing at all, its a very often overlooked issue,

Thanks Mark. You know I haven't had an alinment done to my car since I lowered it and got larger wheels. I guess I should do that first :)

Bry

Furious
08-19-2003, 02:52 AM
no problem , lemme know what you find out. also i heard you punked out of the cruise this past weekend :D , mike said you were suppose to show up.

nzer
08-19-2003, 09:51 AM
perhaps 0.1 toe at front - 0.1 at back, just play with it

e30-323ti
08-19-2003, 10:14 PM
Hi NZer, good to see another kiwi on the board.


Autotechnica FYI a 323GTX is 4wd not Fwd.

SpudBoy
08-20-2003, 02:09 AM
TC off does make it easier the get the tail to come around but the car does not 4 wheel drift the way my e36 did. The coupe has a higher limit due to the wider tires and more aggressive suspension. The coupe is more fun tho IMHO yeehaaa*th-up*

330DTM
08-20-2003, 04:26 AM
Could be the technique you're using too as to why you can't get the car to overtseer. If all else fails, let Empowered try your car, I'm sure he can do it since he's the master at drifting as seen at the auto-x's. hehe

He drifts with FINESE!

Gamite
08-20-2003, 04:34 AM
Originally posted by 328DTM

He drifts with FINESE!

too bad that's all he does with finese... :P lol j/k

Autotechnica
08-20-2003, 01:12 PM
Originally posted by 328DTM
Could be the technique you're using too as to why you can't get the car to overtseer. If all else fails, let Empowered try your car, I'm sure he can do it since he's the master at drifting as seen at the auto-x's. hehe

He drifts with FINESE!

sounds like a plan *th-up*