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View Full Version : driving e30 through the winter with all seasons?


jasonbaek
11-01-2011, 06:21 PM
Yeah I know what you guys think but in this winter I'm only gonna drive around toronto downtown 15km per day..(I can even ride a subway when it's really snowy) and I'm out of country for whole December. Until now I had no problem driving downtown with all seasons but I never drove rwd with no traction control in winter so I'm bit worried.
What do you guys think? I hope I can get through the winter with some sand bags in trunk and my michelin exalto..

E30M42cab
11-01-2011, 07:07 PM
Steer with your rear wheels like we all do. Winters or not, you will still lose traction unless you drive like a granny. Traction control is for sissies.

BMe30
11-01-2011, 07:08 PM
i wouldnt...
get snows.. dont use sandbags.. and everything will be fine

phreshSOCKS
11-01-2011, 07:18 PM
I drove all last year in my other e30 lowered with shitty tires and no weight in the trunk. Drove 40 mins highway and city everyday and never really had to many problems, other than plowing the highway for free and having to avoid certain roads. I know its not the greatest thing to do with a classic but I'm a broke e30 fan and sadly you won't be alone as I will be doing the same. Not the best idea for such a classic but a lot of fun in an empty parking lot.

BMe30
11-01-2011, 07:21 PM
empty parking lot? any corner lol more so when you have lsd rear end!

jasonbaek
11-01-2011, 07:36 PM
No worries. I normally drive like a granny.. I guess I shouldn't take mt pleasant downhill in winter..and I can stick with ttc although they get shittier in winter

North
11-01-2011, 07:45 PM
last winter I drove on half-worn all seasons, mostly because of a lack of money. This year the plan was to garage the e30 and take the bus, but that is no longer an option, so I'm going to rock some balloon winters on basketweaves, hopefully that'll counteract the H&R Races.

Eurostyle
11-02-2011, 01:02 AM
Yeah I know what you guys think but in this winter I'm only gonna drive around toronto downtown 15km per day..(I can even ride a subway when it's really snowy) and I'm out of country for whole December. Until now I had no problem driving downtown with all seasons but I never drove rwd with no traction control in winter so I'm bit worried.
What do you guys think? I hope I can get through the winter with some sand bags in trunk and my michelin exalto..

What is the point of posting if you already know!? You just need someone to tell you its OK to feel better!? Just go take a look at this http://www.maxbimmer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146723
This was an experienced driver, with very capable car...You would be lucky if the ABS still works in an E30! Anyone trying to save $$$ from buying tires should stay home...keep the rest of us safe. I'm sorry if i sound harsh, but i gotta look at crashed cars like this all day, and this s#it is scary..

lumlumty
11-02-2011, 12:39 PM
quote "Steer with your rear wheels like we all do. Winters or not, you will still lose traction unless you drive like a granny. Traction control is for sissies."

Buy winter tires. I am glad they made it mandatory in Quebec.
I have Hakkapelitta 5 and I don't have a problem. I only got stuck on once last year.
Yes it does take more time when you stop on a hill but other then that it is fine.
Shovel and a salt bag to melt ice with good tires and you should be fine. LSD definitely helps too.

propr'one
11-02-2011, 12:43 PM
Anyone trying to save $$$ from buying tires should stay home...keep the rest of us safe. I'm sorry if i sound harsh, but i gotta look at crashed cars like this all day, and this s#it is scary..

I'm with Fil.

Buy winter tires. If you're buying a used set, make sure they're less than 5 years old and have LOTS of tread (Winter tires drop off pretty noticeably under 50% tread, they're practically un-usable). Finally, don't trust your tires until you learn where the grip is or isn't.

Winter tires are less than your deductible for your insurance. Its not worth the risk.

jasonbaek
11-02-2011, 01:35 PM
Thank you all for the advice. I'll have to find a storage to store my all seasons first, one of my friends should be able to help with that.. If not I'll just take the ttc when there's snow.

T.Dot_E30
11-02-2011, 01:38 PM
14'' snows are F****** cheap, i wish i could go back to those.

If your broke ass can't afford $100 for two brand new snows, you shouldn't be driving.

Ceeker
11-02-2011, 02:19 PM
14'' snows are F****** cheap, i wish i could go back to those.

If your broke ass can't afford $100 for two brand new snows, you shouldn't be driving.

LOL so true!!!!

jasonbaek
11-02-2011, 02:58 PM
As soon as I find place to store my euroweaves, I'll try to get set of used snows with bottlecaps or 14" steelies. Thanks.

DR.ZED
11-02-2011, 05:03 PM
Most accidents in the winter come down to "if only I had the extra foot of stopping power."

Winter tires will give you that.

If you've never experienced the traction of winter tires, you're in for something you've never expected. Get a newer set that isn't well worn.

I drove my lowered Camaro with good winter tires for 3 seasons. I went places most cars were not able to, no kidding.

phreshSOCKS
11-02-2011, 09:21 PM
empty parking lot? any corner lol more so when you have lsd rear end!

yeah but I suggest starting in a parking lot. And this is my first winter on my new LSD! Hope it makes a big difference.

MaxBell
11-02-2011, 09:31 PM
yeah but I suggest starting in a parking lot. And this is my first winter on my new LSD! Hope it makes a big difference.

YES it will. I powered past tons of stuck vehicles, fishtailing my way to safety.

It parkings lots are so much fun, feels like I have 500 hp.

BMe30
11-02-2011, 10:04 PM
yeah but I suggest starting in a parking lot. And this is my first winter on my new LSD! Hope it makes a big difference.

More than you know.... 5spd, rwd, lsd.... Pure joy. I recommend nitto winter tires... On my second set this year... They are perfect!

MaxBell
11-03-2011, 12:02 AM
More than you know.... 5spd, rwd, lsd.... Pure joy. I recommend nitto winter tires... On my second set this year... They are perfect!

Nittos, TOYO and Nokia are great. Stay away from that Goodyear Michelin shit.

njansenv
11-03-2011, 09:49 AM
I LOVED the Hankook iPike W409's on our E30.
How new are your all-seasons? What type? Some fresh all-seasons are better than others.
I'd HIGHLY recommend buying a used set of snows mounted on steelies at the very least. Heck, I have some OLD snows with decent tread that worked well that you could have for $120, mounted on steelies.

jasonbaek
11-03-2011, 02:28 PM
I LOVED the Hankook iPike W409's on our E30.
How new are your all-seasons? What type? Some fresh all-seasons are better than others.
I'd HIGHLY recommend buying a used set of snows mounted on steelies at the very least. Heck, I have some OLD snows with decent tread that worked well that you could have for $120, mounted on steelies.

Tires are good(less than 8k on them). they have directional thread and they're good for wet road.. Well when I come back to canada on Jan I'll find 4 set of snows..

adam325i
11-06-2011, 11:02 AM
I drove my E30 from Tofino BC, thru Whistler,Revelstoke, Sun Peaks, Banff back to Hamilton Ontario, on all season motomasters. Biggest thing as you should always be doing is stay alert and aware of your suroundings and conditions. Drove all the way with no problems at all. I bought snow chains out there since there legal and the only time used them is driving thru my trailer park in the winter in ontario. Be safe this winter!

noid
11-26-2011, 11:13 PM
Get snow tires all around, a car the weight of an e30 needs them.

Best thing to do is have two sets of tires, summer tires for the summer and snow tires for the winter.

InfiniteDice
11-27-2011, 01:37 PM
Sometimes no matter how safe you are things happen... that's the way it is.

Every year I seem to tell someone that I drove through a few horrible winter storms with 0 visibility at times, I passed 3 or 4 transport trucks, jeeps, subarus, some of them upside down. There I go past them at 120 kph in my nearly ancient car with no jee whiz gadgets. I wouldn't want to crash in my car that's for sure, but it's all about how comfortable you are in the car, and knowing what the limits are. If you see a car in the ditch let off the gas and coast it, there could be ice under the snow. If a rabbit runs across the road in bad weather... hit the rabbit. If you are in a slide and you can't save it, point the car at a curb or ditch. Better that then tail-ending someone.

Last year with winter tires I had to try to make it slide to have some fun, too much grip.

Generally speaking the city bombards the highways and roads with all kinds of salt and crap. In the city except on the worst of days all-seasons will do. I don't know what the deal is... I've only had dedicated winter wheels for the past 3 years. All the other years of living up north I had all seasons and let me tell you the winter is 10x worse up there.

My suggestion is that if you drive on smaller 2 lane highways or out in the middle of nowhere up north then get really good winter tires.

If you are scared of ice go ahead and get ice tires, ice tires are not deep snow tires and you'll most likely get stuck just as easy in deep snow.

Further north keep a set of tire chains in the trunk, the town I was in was all ice/snow roads. I drove on chains with the e30 for months, not over 25-30 and not on pavement. Expect to replace the rear shock mounts, but you'll never get stuck unless you hang the car.

I'll be heading up north to pick up my boy on Dec 26th or 27th. Sometimes it's Valdor, sometimes it's Waskaganish (1500km). That's when I go, come hell or high water. I don't care if there is a blizzard or if it's -45. I've done it at least 20 times in the winter and I've always made it in the e30.

Yamahammer
11-27-2011, 10:54 PM
Who gives a shit.... drive your car and don;t worry about it. I did last winter in the e30 everyday on walmart all seasons. if your gonna crash with all season you are gonna crash with snows, just at a higher speed.......

Eurostyle
11-28-2011, 02:25 AM
Who gives a shit.... drive your car and don;t worry about it. I did last winter in the e30 everyday on walmart all seasons. if your gonna crash with all season you are gonna crash with snows, just at a higher speed.......

Stupidest post i have seen in some time...If you drive on Walmart all seasons in a Canadian winter, you should not drive a BMW. Who gives a sh#t?, maybe the people you will crash into, and possibly kill. Winters dont make you go faster (before you crash), but do stop better so might not have to!!! fcplm

Yamahammer
11-28-2011, 10:17 AM
Stupidest post i have seen in some time...If you drive on Walmart all seasons in a Canadian winter, you should not drive a BMW. Who gives a sh#t?, maybe the people you will crash into, and possibly kill. Winters dont make you go faster (before you crash), but do stop better so might not have to!!! fcplm

Thanks for the insult. I may be blunt and slightly out of line in stating my opinion but that is my prerogative. "Canadian winters" s an out of date term because we have what? maybe 5 days each winter now that you may need snow tires for. So we just drive our shitty winter tires on dry pavement for half a year, then get charged by Dalton mcquinty to have them disposed of, or they get thrown in the landfill which is real nice:huh?:

All I was saying is that you can easily make it through a "canadian winter" without having to spend money on winter tires.

So I apologize if offended you with my stupid comment, I am glad you set me straight *wave*

InfiniteDice
11-28-2011, 11:50 AM
Technically tires matching road conditions will give you more lateral grip, so you can go quicker before you'll slide. Winter tires for snow, ice tires ice, and summer tires summer. All season will have less grip in any of these conditions than tires made for it. Although you can go faster I wouldn't advise speeding in snow just because you have snow tires.

Of all conditions I'd say the worse by far is slush. Or slush over ice. Sometimes I'll be driving along and suddenly the wheel is weightless. That's when you let off the gas and slowly bring the speed down till the weight in the wheel returns.

The scary part is driving on a two lane and hydroplaning off some slush while passing a logging truck head on.

Everyone drive safe and have a good winter!

BigD
11-28-2011, 12:37 PM
"Canadian winters" s an out of date term because we have what? maybe 5 days each winter now that you may need snow tires for. So we just drive our shitty winter tires on dry pavement for half a year, then get charged by Dalton mcquinty to have them disposed of, or they get thrown in the landfill which is real nice:huh?:

+1 to that

I share your sentiments. You can drive a superbike on racing slicks in the winter if you want to (I drove my M5 on bald ZR track tires, a few times through bad Waterloo snowstorms). You just have to drive in accordance to the conditions and your car's abilities. Winter crashes don't happen because people didn't have the few meters of extra stopping power but because they drive like assholes (in the dry, wet and snow). The only difference is that when the unexpected happens, their 2 car length following of the cars in front while doing their makeup and texting, in the dry gave them a small chance to avoid it (as demonstrated by daily traffic jams due to "accidents") but in the snow, it means they're invariably going to participate in what happens next.

And like you said, there are maybe a few serious snow days in the GTA tops, and for all but the worst kind, the major roads are clear shortly after. Just drive carefully or worst case you can take a day off.

I'm not against winter tires per se, I'd encourage anyone to get them. But I disagree that people HAVE TO get them living in Toronto. We're not in the tundra with unpaved, unplowed roads.

frankie591
11-28-2011, 10:12 PM
Stupidest post i have seen in some time...If you drive on Walmart all seasons in a Canadian winter, you should not drive a BMW. Who gives a sh#t?, maybe the people you will crash into, and possibly kill. Winters dont make you go faster (before you crash), but do stop better so might not have to!!! fcplm

you act like owning a bmw is some type of privilage that must be taken with great responsibility. you aren't the e30 police so dont run your mouth and tell people how they should drive their cars. until the ontario government makes it illegal to drive without specific winter tires then this point is completely irrelevant

noodles101
11-28-2011, 10:32 PM
OP, if u live in toronto u dont need snow tires. some good all seasons will do. and learn how to bring ur tail back when it whips out . ( empty parking lot first lol )

dble Trouble
11-29-2011, 10:44 AM
It drives me crazy when I hear people can't afford ________what ever. Where are your priorities people? Usually (and I know I'm generalizing hear) but the people that say they can't afford it are typically the ones who have an iphone, or crackberry, with some sort of data plan, or go out drinking on weekends, or go on vacations at least once a year they also typically have a flat panel tv, surround sound etc etc. That shit is important but snow tires aren't? I mean Jesus! I bought used snows on steelies 14" last year for my e30 that looked almost new for $250. I put 20,000km on them and they still look new. Lose your fancy gadgets and don't go out for 3 weeks and there are your snow tires!
It doesn't matter that you can go through a winter without. That's not the point. It's there so that if and when (god forbid) you get thrown into an emergency manoeuver that you're more likely to come out unscathed than if you had less grip ie all seasons. And yes I do agree with Fil, in the respect that you have to remember the people you may hit as result of your negligence might be me and my family!

On another topic, something that no one has touched on yet is the ineffectiveness of all seasons on dry pavement that is below 7 degrees celsius. You don't need snow to feel the benefits of snow tires, or the weaknesses of all seasons. On a 0 degree day, on clean dry pavement take a set of average all seasons and accelerate hard away from a traffic light, then do the same with snows, the all seasons will spin more easily, than the snows. This is an easy way to demonstrate how the all seasons become hard in the cold and act more like a hockey puck thus giving you less grip.

dble Trouble
11-29-2011, 10:48 AM
Oh and another thing, having two sets of tires is actually just as cheap or even cheaper than one set. You're dividing the mileage you do on a set of tires in two. The mileage you do on your snows, prolongs your summers/all seasons, plus the salt will not tarnish your mag wheels! In the long run you save money and the look of your summer set up. The reason I say cheaper is because snow tires are typically cheaper than summer tires.

T.Dot_E30
11-29-2011, 11:00 AM
"Canadian winters" s an out of date term because we have what? maybe 5 days each winter now that you may need snow tires for.


And like you said, there are maybe a few serious snow days in the GTA tops, and for all but the worst kind, the major roads are clear shortly after. Just drive carefully or worst case you can take a day off.


Quoted so that later in Jan/Feb we can recount the number of snow storms we had.

5 days of snow? Where were you last winter? Read the news they are saying this year will be worse with a lot of freeze/thaw cycles.

Yamahammer
11-29-2011, 01:04 PM
Quoted so that later in Jan/Feb we can recount the number of snow storms we had.

5 days of snow? Where were you last winter? Read the news they are saying this year will be worse with a lot of freeze/thaw cycles.

Im glad you have the free time to count how many snow falls we have. You want a calendar? I got a bunch in the mail. I have a nice one from the conservatives with a bunch of pictures of Steven Harper and his family. I quite like it. Then you can say "Hey! Yamahammer! we don't take kindly to your folk round here! we had 6 snowy days this year!"

Vrbovsky
12-02-2011, 12:53 AM
I'm west of London... we had a thousand snowfalls, or so it seamed. E30s in the winter are fun and if you don't care about salt and rust then go for it! let's be clear on this an e30 isn't worth shit.... a mint example is what 6,000$???? this is not an outrageous amount of money and certainly not garage queen values. but to each his own... i used to store my e30... then i was like... why? its not a super rare example that needs to be saved... its a car that needs to be driven.

so is it ok do drive your 4,000$ car in winter? why the **** not?
is it a good idea not to use snows? no, but drive accordingly if you haven't got em.

and Yamahammer.... Stephen Harper's family is rented for photo ops and calenders, you know that right?

dble Trouble
12-02-2011, 09:39 AM
New stats out of Quebec where snow tires have been mandatory for two years, 525 fewer accidents, 5% decline in fatalities and so on. Just saying.....

T.Dot_E30
12-02-2011, 09:45 AM
Im glad you have the free time to count how many snow falls we have. You want a calendar? I got a bunch in the mail. I have a nice one from the conservatives with a bunch of pictures of Steven Harper and his family. I quite like it. Then you can say "Hey! Yamahammer! we don't take kindly to your folk round here! we had 6 snowy days this year!"

Your just making yourself look stupider, keep digging....

jasonbaek
12-02-2011, 12:44 PM
Guys.. I will be wearing snows in the winter! Although I will be driving 3~4 times a week and less than 15km per day.. and I can always leave my car at home and take the TTC with the road is horrible(although when the road is horrible, taking the subway can be PITA). To make things better we have own carwash station right at the underground parking lot so e30 will be safe from the rust!

InfiniteDice
12-02-2011, 12:59 PM
let's be clear on this an e30 isn't worth shit.... a mint example is what 6,000$???? this is not an outrageous amount of money and certainly not garage queen values.

If you like the car then it has value, the price of e30's could start rising soon I've been seeing a few warning signs with regards to availability and prices of various parts.

Value. It depends on how you define value. If you define it as the amount of money you can get for something then yes an e30 has less monetary value than a 2011 M5.

If we look at value from the perspective of what an object does versus how much it costs. Then the e30 still has good value. If I can drive to work every day, go get groceries, on the weekends drive out in the country and whatever... then the car fulfills it's purpose and has value.

One car costs 6000 and the other 120k+ ???

Keeping a car in a garage preserves it's function as a car. Not too many cars are investments, in fact no car YOU can afford is an investment so long as you use it. Once used the devaluation of even an m5 could buy you many e30's. The only exception is the really old car - where not too many examples are remaining.

Or instead of an M5 I could by 3 e30's and invest the rest in gold and actually make money instead of losing money on the m5 over the years.

Value is a subjective term, what it comes down to is if the item performs the task it was made to perform. If I have a car that looks the way I like and drives how I like... what do I care what people will say it's worth? It performs it's tasks and saves me money.

If you want investments buy some gold or silver.

Ceeker
12-02-2011, 06:29 PM
I don't care where you are; if you own an e30 invest in some "decent" winter tires. Not just any. I've had shitty winters on and got stuck everywhere. I have bought Pirelli or I-pikes or hakka -whatever they call em..are great for this model. With some driving skill and any of these 3 tires you are unstoppable in winter driving conditions. they are reasonably priced too. One snow storm is all you need and you're done for! Who gives a shit how many snow falls there were during the season. You don't need snow to potentially wipe the car out. It's called Black ice and called rubber traction. It is a fact that once the temp drops below 6 degrees the all season tire compound's effectiveness is drastically reduced to stop and control the car. the compound gets hard. Winter tire compounds are much softer and are designed with colder temp in mind. The stopping distance is much shorter as well in emergency situations.

so lets look at the economics of this: 4 tires pirelli - approx 500.00
upside: assurance, better control, not getting stuck, saving your nice rims from old man winter and salt.
Downside: is there only a couple besides the expense that you make that will last 4-5 seasons? divide this out 100.00 per winter
Storage space for the winter tires.

Upside to having no winter tires? hmm..perhaps the savings of +500?
downside: well extra storage space needed for summers.
cost of getting towed because of getting stuck -if you don't own RSA.
the wait time for getting stuck during bad weather. usually 1-2 hours if not more with RSA.
increased risk of getting into accident. loss of control -hitting something. potential cost of repair.
increase stress driving because the car isn't handling properly.
fear of going out during bad weather for risk of getting stuck.

Note: winter tires doesn't mean you are invisible..lol. just helps alot to have them.

it has been my experience that winter tires are superior to all season regardless what the tires says. They are meant only for light snow like we had this week. if you decide to drive with them you will have to remind yourself of winter driving skills and quite possible you could get away with the all seasons if the winter is mild. not to say you won't. :-)

noodles101
12-02-2011, 06:50 PM
yup, get winter tires. i drove with all seasons.. no accidents but a lot of embarassing moments where i couldn't get up this tiny tiny hill -__- ..........

Ceeker
12-02-2011, 07:12 PM
As soon as I find place to store my euroweaves, I'll try to get set of used snows with bottlecaps or 14" steelies. Thanks.

DON'T buy used and cheap out to save a 100-200 bucks..if you do they should be almost new. the compounds do deteriorate like summers do over time if not stored properly. Unless you are familiar with brands, how to determine prod date on tires and know what signs to look for in years of wear and cracking. I would just go and spend the extra and get new. done deal.

noodles101
12-02-2011, 11:08 PM
also hate noobs on the road...only buying 2 tires instead of 4... ( major face paaaaaalm )