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View Full Version : grrrr etest failed... some help where to start


BMWnoob
06-18-2009, 02:51 PM
So I had to get some ownership transfering done and the MTO says i have to redo etest..i did as told and it failed in one category

Curb Idle HC PPM 200 / 718 FAILED

40KM Limit / Reading Results
HC PPM 60 / 13 Passed
CO% 0.33 / 0.18 Passed
NO 0675 /19 Passed

Curb Idle Limit/ Reading Results
HC PPM 200/ 718 FAILED
CO% 1 /0.07 Passed


Anyone help with where to start?
searching tells me misfire, dirty injectors and unburnt gas

I sometimes get the feeling that the car smells a lot inside of gas. (could be just me reving too much learning to drive it but my dad mentioned the car smells quite a bit as well) Possible vaccum leak of some sort?

Any help for the clueless?

Duct_Taper
06-18-2009, 02:55 PM
High HC at idle means it's running rich.

Does it idle properly? Any smoke?

I'd check the IAC for a start.

Max_VQ
06-18-2009, 03:12 PM
I agree that it seems to be running rich at idle.
How old are the O2 sensors and spark plugs?

BigD
06-18-2009, 03:27 PM
If a car you just bought fails emissions, replace the spark plugs and O2 sensor before guessing. Buy an O2 from a 5.0 Mustang from Crappy Tire for 55 bucks (exact same Bosch sensor), crimp on the connector from your old one. If it still fails at that time, then start thinking.

BMWnoob
06-18-2009, 03:43 PM
i don't notice any smoke on idle.. and it seems to be running nice... it pretty much starts right up if i stall or first start of the day..

what is the IAC? as everyone knows already i don't know anything about anything...when it comes to cars

BigD
06-18-2009, 04:20 PM
If it starts smoking then it's time to call a car priest. Change the spark plugs and O2 sensor.

SamE30e
06-18-2009, 05:12 PM
Do the plugs, wires, o2 and check for vacuum leaks.

propr'one
06-18-2009, 05:27 PM
methyl hydrate in the gas.

BMWnoob
06-18-2009, 06:13 PM
anybody want to help me do something on the weekend lol...

methyl hydrate.. google tells me this is antifreeze... i just pour some into the gas tank.. is this going to cause harm? should i be worried that the car actually failed etest? i don't mind spending some money to "fix" whatever needs to be fixed since i've invested into this car already

thank again everyone!

Bullet Ride
06-18-2009, 06:19 PM
what is the IAC? as everyone knows already i don't know anything about anything...when it comes to cars

Idle Air Control

Should be #5 I believe, the e30 guys can verify.
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=BB13&mospid=47326&btnr=13_0597&hg=13&fg=15&hl=33

E30M42cab
06-18-2009, 06:26 PM
^^ICV. Idle control valve. Probably not the cause for rich idle though. Rough yes. I would bet it's just the O2.

e30jones
06-18-2009, 06:50 PM
methyl hydrate.. google tells me this is antifreeze... i just pour some into the gas tank.. is this going to cause harm? ...

Gasline antifreeze, not just "antifreeze". Burns cleaner and hotter than gas, as it's alcohol IIRC. I'd probably try and fix what's broken first, methyl hydrate as a last resort.

Spark plugs, adjust your valves, O2 sensor to start with, don't forget a new air filter if it hasn't been done.

Just a though, if it's rich at idle but not off idle, could it be the TPS idle switch not connecting properly (ie/ car isn't going into the idle loop, dumping too much gas at idle?) With the car off, open your hood and move the throttle butterfly from closed to open, and then let it close again. Listen closely to see if you can hear a quiet click. If no click, it's not hitting the idle microswitch.

BMWnoob
06-18-2009, 08:19 PM
o2 sensor is new, spark plugs are new.. my dad smells gas fumes on the left side of the car.. any ideas?

5thseries
06-18-2009, 08:29 PM
Check the pcv valve
Red line
High grade fuel ;)
Hows the catilic
and yah =)

BigD
06-18-2009, 08:54 PM
o2 sensor is new, spark plugs are new.. my dad smells gas fumes on the left side of the car.. any ideas?

You know this because you were told so or because you've paid to have these things replaced?

richie_s999
06-19-2009, 12:57 AM
I thought E test were good for 6 months for ownership change?? what year is it, isn't 88 and older done with e-tests?

edit - 87 and older no e test required just checked

richie_s999
06-19-2009, 01:05 AM
How long is the pass report valid for?
A Drive Clean pass certificate is valid for 12 months from its date of issue. During that time the registration can be renewed and ownership can be transferred. It must still be valid on the registration expiry date, or for late renewals or vehicle transfers, it must be valid on the date of transaction.

this is copied from the minisrty web site - http://www.ene.gov.on.ca/en/air/driveclean/ldv_faq.php

if there was a valid test done in the last 12 months you could use it to transpher ownership

BMWnoob
06-19-2009, 07:47 AM
yes but the stupid MTO system doesn't have record of it anymore... they did two weeks ago though.. it's a long story.. i had to transfer and transfer and again to the wife for insurance purposes... and big blue box says etest required!

InfiniteDice
06-19-2009, 09:01 AM
Gas fumes, I would check the gas lines, change the fuel filter at the same time. You'll want to get new hose and hose clamps, I'd get BMW hose clamps, they last much longer than anything else I've bought. It could be possible that something is up with the valve leading to the charcoal canister.

A vacuum leak wouldn't smell like gas. All the fuel lines run on the left hand side, with the car off, the hose should be pliable, if it's hard replace it, hard hoses get small fractures that leak.

Did you run it really good down the highway for 20 minutes before the test? There are additives and other tricks as well. I don't know the details, I have an 87! ;)

richie_s999
06-19-2009, 09:40 AM
yes but the stupid MTO system doesn't have record of it anymore... they did two weeks ago though.. it's a long story.. i had to transfer and transfer and again to the wife for insurance purposes... and big blue box says etest required!



something's fishy with that you can check your self with the vin number at the drive clean web site

BMWnoob
06-19-2009, 10:53 AM
something's fishy with that you can check your self with the vin number at the drive clean web site

THANK YOU SOOO MUCH! i called drive clean.. they said must have been a system glitch and are reprinting the etest and mailing to me... i wouldn't have to do another etest till 2011

richie_s999
06-19-2009, 10:57 AM
THANK YOU SOOO MUCH! i called drive clean.. they said must have been a system glitch and are reprinting the etest and mailing to me... i wouldn't have to do another etest till 2011

*par-t**par-t**par-t*


Now get it ready and come meet everyone at the E30 cruise on the 28th!!!!

BMWnoob
06-19-2009, 11:35 AM
*par-t**par-t**par-t*


Now get it ready and come meet everyone at the E30 cruise on the 28th!!!!

As soon as I learn how to drive it lol I'm getting there but the wife still
needs some practice

Magical24
07-09-2009, 02:17 PM
i just bought an 89 325 does it qualify as a classic and i dont need an etest or am i going to have to etest it and saftey test it to transfer the ownership of the car into my name if anyone has any info on this just send me a pm

thanks
magic

everlast
07-09-2009, 04:29 PM
Did you read the first post on this page?

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 12:32 PM
THANK YOU SOOO MUCH! i called drive clean.. they said must have been a system glitch and are reprinting the etest and mailing to me... i wouldn't have to do another etest till 2011

grrrr got an etest letter in the mail.. because of my multiple ownership transfers.. (IE to wifey) need to do another etest... and probably gonna fail again..

pops just called and yep it failed again.. same thing

HC PPM 200/ 600's FAILED

should i just start throwing parts at it??? cause they want $145 to do an inspection...

everlast
08-20-2009, 12:40 PM
What have you already done? I would change the oil and run a can of seafoam through it, then try again before doing any parts.

And try a different etest place; some are "better" than others it seems.

El Gato Liso
08-20-2009, 12:43 PM
my e30 failed HC the other day...miserably.

HC = hydrocarbons = UNBURNED FUEL!!!

basically what i did was take off the the intake boot, and the idle control valve.
got rubbing alcohol and cleaned all the gunk and mumbo jumbo out of it, but use a Qtip for the ICV.

went back the next day....passed amazingly! the etest took 20 seconds i thought i failed, but it was so good its like **** it you pass.

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 12:45 PM
What have you already done? I would change the oil and run a can of seafoam through it, then try again before doing any parts.

And try a different etest place; some are "better" than others it seems.

seafoam is that the same stuff as redline? where do i buy it? canadian tire? haven't really done anything just told my dad to take it in and try again.. it's still parked at his house lol and wifey only drives it on weekends...

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 12:47 PM
my e30 failed HC the other day...miserably.

HC = hydrocarbons = UNBURNED FUEL!!!

basically what i did was take off the the intake boot, and the idle control valve.
got rubbing alcohol and cleaned all the gunk and mumbo jumbo out of it, but use a Qtip for the ICV.

went back the next day....passed amazingly! the etest took 20 seconds i thought i failed, but it was so good its like **** it you pass.

ok can a person like me do this.. i only know how to pop the hood and check oil lol

everlast
08-20-2009, 12:47 PM
HC's can be gas or oil. Once you really get into it, it can have many causes including rings, valve adjustment, plugs, sludge build up, etc.

Seafoam is your best bet to pass for the short term. Don't use 93 / 94 octane gas either, and make sure your car has been up to temperature for a least 30 minutes, and don't shut it off while waiting for the test to commence. Tell them your battery is low so they keep it running perhaps.

everlast
08-20-2009, 12:49 PM
No, seafoam is.. seafoam. You can get it at NAPA, I know, probably other places too, like CT. I poured half in the gas and sucked half up an intake vacuum line while the car was running. If there is a lot of gunk in the motor, it will smoke like a MOFO (check youtube).

Make SURE the car is VERY hot for the test. I highly doubt it will just "pass" by going back.

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 01:04 PM
for the seafoam i run it till it's empty i guess... and then fill it up with regular gas?

everlast
08-20-2009, 01:11 PM
Here's what I did:

Changed my oil.
@ 1/3 tank of gas, I added 1/2 the bottle of seafoam on friday night.
Removed a vacuum line from the brake booster and slowly sucked up the remainder of the seafoam into the engine. Go VERY slowly.
Saturday morning, I drove for 1/2 hour on the highway in 4th, straight to the etest place and my car passed fine.

Your experience will vary. This worked for me, but if your valves are out of adjustment or the rings are shot, nothing will magically help you pass etest.

You should post all your numbers from the etest results.

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 01:27 PM
Here's what I did:

Changed my oil.
@ 1/3 tank of gas, I added 1/2 the bottle of seafoam on friday night.
Removed a vacuum line from the brake booster and slowly sucked up the remainder of the seafoam into the engine. Go VERY slowly.
Saturday morning, I drove for 1/2 hour on the highway in 4th, straight to the etest place and my car passed fine.

Your experience will vary. This worked for me, but if your valves are out of adjustment or the rings are shot, nothing will magically help you pass etest.

You should post all your numbers from the etest results.

ok will get the results in a bit

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 02:17 PM
40km
Hcppm 60/45 pass
Co% 0.33/0.20 pass
Noppm 0675/29 pass
Rpm 1837 valid
Dilution 15.50 valid

Curb idle
Limit 200/616 fail
Co% 1/0.59 pass
Rpm 763 valid
Dilution 15.59 valid

everlast
08-20-2009, 03:54 PM
How hot was the motor? Where was the temp gauge? It sounds like the car is getting extra fuel at idle at that point, since its so markedly higher at idle yet fine during the run. This could be due to the car not being up to temp fully yet (30 mins of running) or the temp sensor being out of spec.

How does it idle? Smooth, solid or hitchy and/or rough?

everlast
08-20-2009, 03:55 PM
Also, could be the thermostat keeping the temp down, if that is the case.

Alternatively, a slow / cold O2 sensor could cause this as well. It may not be detecting the extra fuel and leaning out. Know how old the sensor is?

everlast
08-20-2009, 03:57 PM
Upon more thought, poor plugs could cause a slight idle misfire too, which would cause the high HC at idle.

supernaught
08-20-2009, 04:35 PM
HOLY ****ING SHIT SHE PASSED!@!!!!!!!

(re: my IX that has ben under the knife for over a year)

supernaught
08-20-2009, 04:45 PM
BOUJA!
NEW:
Schrick 272
Ported and polished head
M30 AFM
19lb injectors
no name chip
87 oct
no methyl hydrate, I dropped it off the night before so it wasn't hot, car hasn't run in more than a year.
Passed with flying colours and no cheating!

everlast
08-20-2009, 04:46 PM
A well maintained motor in good shape with a good cat should always pass.

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 05:07 PM
ok so what should i do as a first step?

seaform and clean the ICV and boot?

i ran a bottle of that redline stuff a while back.. it's supposed to clean the plugs right?

from what i can tell.. the car runs and feels smooth.. idle is good too.. no flucuations sits in the 700 range

everlast
08-20-2009, 05:19 PM
First you need to answer the rest of the questions. Not to be rude, but I can't really say much else until then.

BMWnoob
08-20-2009, 11:00 PM
First you need to answer the rest of the questions. Not to be rude, but I can't really say much else until then.

no worries my bad..

hmm car was on and off but it was on the highway for a good 10-15 mins...but i need 30 you say.

the sensor is about 1 year old i think
i have no idea about the thermostat but the guage in the car was sitting in the middle? sorry i don't really know what i'm talking about lol

everlast
08-20-2009, 11:12 PM
Gauge in middle = good
one year old sensor = good
warmish = ok, VERY hot motor is best

it only takes about 10 to 15 mins for coolant to hit maximum temp, but if the thermostat was stuck open you wouldn't hit full heat at highway speed, therefore be running cool and rich thanks to the ECU thinking you need more fuel to run

So, start the car from cold, let it idle for 5 to 10 mins and see how long the the rad hose that is on the low passenger side takes to get warm. That could diagnose a thermostat.

Other than that, I'd change the oil and change the plugs to new ones. Coupled with a seafoam treatment and fully hot engine (even letting the car idle for 20 mins before the test would be acceptable, not great for the cats but they look ok) I would go for a retest and see how you do.

After that you'll need someone first hand to diagnose further I'm afraid; that's the end of my ideas.

BMWnoob
08-21-2009, 12:45 PM
thanks

everlast
08-21-2009, 12:53 PM
Good luck!

BMWnoob
08-26-2009, 11:01 AM
alright guys.. i haven't had time or the knowledge to try things out or get to know things better...

anyone recommend someone to look at my car to help it pass etest. It's in the oakville area right now monday to friday and i can drop it off during the day somewhere.

on the weekend i can meet up as well.

or should i just bite the bullet and pay the etest shop $145 to diagnose and then $X to repair...

BMWnoob
09-03-2009, 12:06 PM
well i'm finally free for 2 years... idle needed a little extra help to pass...
but whatever it's done now..

supernaught
09-03-2009, 12:07 PM
congrats!